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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2022 11:11 pm 
 

All of their last three are easily my favorites since the 80s, with AMOLAD pretty close too. I don't have any issues with them.
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Mountain
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 1:22 pm
Posts: 55
PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2022 12:30 am 
 

soulonfire wrote:
I actually liked Haunted and that EP they released around that time.


Me too. Haunted is basically Allen West playing Obituary riffs with Chris Barnes before his vocals went to shit. I'd assume hearing it in 2022 would be less than spectacular nowadays, but in '95 it was a solid album. I remember his vocals on the track "Insect" were really good on that EP.

I tried listening to Warpath when it came out and remember thinking it was rather lackluster besides a few songs. Stopped listening to them after that.

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Ace_Rimmer
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:30 am
Posts: 4606
PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2022 11:51 am 
 

Rico McPato wrote:
I'm ambivalent on modern Maiden. Most of the material follows the same template, but I find the quality uneven.


I am big fan of AMOLAD, which is kind of the spiritual twin of The X Factor, and those two are my favorite Maiden albums from the last 30+ years. I like Dance of Death a lot, and I think it's the most varied and "fun" of the reunion albums, and the one that comes closer to the spirit of 80s Maiden.

Senjutsu is very good, a solid album that I enjoyed more than anything since AMOLAD, and Brave New World is fine but ultimately find it boring despite its highlights and all the hype and excitement surrounding the era.
I´ve tried a lot but I have never been able to get into Book of Souls and The Final Frontier, despite there being individual songs that I like a lot (Starblind, Isle of Avalon, The Red and the Black). Both are probably my less favorite Maiden albums as I find that, while not bad, they are dull and not very memorable (maybe Fear of the Dark is worse, which despite its very strong highs also has some of Maiden's worst songs).


I will say that despite having songs that need editing and a lot of repetition AMOLAD holds up much better than most of the reunion era. More oomph in the songwriting maybe. Better melodies? Not sure but it doesn’t bore me nearly as much as everything that came out after it. Still rarely listen to it though.

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Gravetemplar
Metal freak

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 4653
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 10:10 am 
 

Ace_Rimmer wrote:
Rico McPato wrote:
I'm ambivalent on modern Maiden. Most of the material follows the same template, but I find the quality uneven.


I am big fan of AMOLAD, which is kind of the spiritual twin of The X Factor, and those two are my favorite Maiden albums from the last 30+ years. I like Dance of Death a lot, and I think it's the most varied and "fun" of the reunion albums, and the one that comes closer to the spirit of 80s Maiden.

Senjutsu is very good, a solid album that I enjoyed more than anything since AMOLAD, and Brave New World is fine but ultimately find it boring despite its highlights and all the hype and excitement surrounding the era.
I´ve tried a lot but I have never been able to get into Book of Souls and The Final Frontier, despite there being individual songs that I like a lot (Starblind, Isle of Avalon, The Red and the Black). Both are probably my less favorite Maiden albums as I find that, while not bad, they are dull and not very memorable (maybe Fear of the Dark is worse, which despite its very strong highs also has some of Maiden's worst songs).


I will say that despite having songs that need editing and a lot of repetition AMOLAD holds up much better than most of the reunion era. More oomph in the songwriting maybe. Better melodies? Not sure but it doesn’t bore me nearly as much as everything that came out after it. Still rarely listen to it though.

Better melodies, more consistent songwriting and darker atmosphere imho.

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Gravetemplar
Metal freak

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 4653
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 10:11 am 
 

Also, Ashes is my favorite Tristania album. Not even sure why.

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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 2:00 pm 
 

The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM

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Lagartija
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 10:27 am
Posts: 2042
Location: Catalunya
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 2:02 pm 
 

I hate pinch harmonics, which is a real bummer when it comes to old Incantation and Immolation (or maybe it's just the way they sound on those albums).
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DeathFusion
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Dec 24, 2019 9:25 pm
Posts: 50
Location: Norway
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 3:11 pm 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM


Definitely, "satanists" would be the first in the gas chambers.

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Chaosmonger
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:59 pm
Posts: 1451
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 3:22 pm 
 

my updated opinion on modern Maiden: The first three reunion albums are the best because, while the choruses are still overly repetitive, the songs are relatively more punchy and still quite metal. The last three go for the epic soundscape effect and most of the tracks don't really land for me. They're taking their time to a fault. I don't dislike the last three but they're moreso albums I just put on as almost background listening. The first three reunion albums I can sing along and rock out to.

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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 3:50 pm 
 

DeathFusion wrote:
Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM


Definitely, "satanists" would be the first in the gas chambers.


The overall style as well. Sing along choruses and epic tales, a clean, family friendly image.

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draconiondevil
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 4:21 pm
Posts: 710
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 7:30 pm 
 

lol now I'm imagining symphonic power metal with racist as fuck lyrics. Racism isn't funny but something about that image is.
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~Guest 285196
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:11 pm
Posts: 2187
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 8:02 pm 
 

I got you fam. And yeah it's pretty funny.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSbnTXm ... sionalisma

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Forever Underground
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:35 am
Posts: 1151
Location: Galiza
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 8:17 pm 
 

Finist never disappoints
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Slater922
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:24 pm
Posts: 2342
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 8:38 pm 
 

Forever Underground wrote:
Finist never disappoints

All politics asides, I guess they're decent. But then again, there are at least 20 other power metal bands that I would rather listen to than them.
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Oheao
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:08 pm
Posts: 208
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2022 9:00 pm 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM

National Socialist metal is absurd in the first place because rock music is so heavily influenced by the works of black artists, without black people there'd be no rock and by extension, metal.

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BLMcommunist
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:29 am
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 3:58 am 
 

Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs

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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 7:23 am 
 

Oheao wrote:
Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM

National Socialist metal is absurd in the first place because rock music is so heavily influenced by the works of black artists, without black people there'd be no rock and by extension, metal.


Not sure if that's how it works, just look at relationship between Judaism, Christianity and Islam (and all the earlier stuff that these developed out of)

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Demon Fang
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:42 am
Posts: 538
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 10:12 am 
 

BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs

Sun and Steel is a genuinely terrific song and nobody can tell either of us otherwise.

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acid_bukkake
SAD!

Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:45 am
Posts: 2232
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 1:52 pm 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:
Oheao wrote:
Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM

National Socialist metal is absurd in the first place because rock music is so heavily influenced by the works of black artists, without black people there'd be no rock and by extension, metal.


Not sure if that's how it works, just look at relationship between Judaism, Christianity and Islam (and all the earlier stuff that these developed out of)

...only we have documented history of the origin for metal and rock n' roll, and they all lead back to black artists in the American south.
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Gravetemplar
Metal freak

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 4653
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 5:31 pm 
 

Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk would be better without keyboards.

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 35180
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 6:00 pm 
 

acid_bukkake wrote:
...only we have documented history of the origin for metal and rock n' roll, and they all lead back to black artists in the American south.


This is why the racist bands are such stupid pieces of shit. Really no justification.
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Benedict Donald
Veteran

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2021 10:36 am
Posts: 3066
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 6:12 pm 
 

BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs


Agreed on 'Gangland' and 'Sun and Steel' as being great songs. The other two are quite good, IMO.

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Smalley
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:06 am
Posts: 1327
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 6:34 pm 
 

Demon Fang wrote:
BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs

Sun and Steel is a genuinely terrific song and nobody can tell either of us otherwise.
Hell yeah!
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draconiondevil
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 4:21 pm
Posts: 710
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2022 9:38 pm 
 

Oheao wrote:
Maggot penetration wrote:
The actual National Socialists would have preferred power metal to NSBM

National Socialist metal is absurd in the first place because rock music is so heavily influenced by the works of black artists, without black people there'd be no rock and by extension, metal.


Yeah the real Nazis would hate all rock music for that reason. They thought swing music was for degenerates for god's sake.
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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 5:20 am 
 

acid_bukkake wrote:
...only we have documented history of the origin for metal and rock n' roll, and they all lead back to black artists in the American south.


You don't have documented history that Judaism spawned Christianity and Islam and god knows what earlier religions all that nonsense came from?

Whilst some NS did try to fade out Christianity, as they recognised it as a Jewish religion, others very much insisted that (Jewish) Jesus must stay. People take things, make them theirs (white Jesus) and use them for their purposes.

Also, the point wasn't if real NS would love metal but that they would prefer power metal to black metal for some of the reasons already mentioned. Mayhem and Burzum vocals alone would raise eyebrows regarding mental health whereas good clean, operatic power metal vocals and lyrics about sword fights would be much closer to a Wagnerian ideal

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CrippledLucifer
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 5:08 am
Posts: 810
Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 6:16 am 
 

I mean, post-1945 nazis are still real nazis and the fact that NSBM exists and is promoted within their circles kinda tells me they are OK with it, the same way as with punk and rock music in general. Which come to think of it, it's much the same as their attitude towards Christianity as pointed out in the post above mine.
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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 6:31 am 
 

Well, yeah, they've adopted pretty much any aggressive music but black metal still seems one of the odder choices, even when it comes to metal. Let's compare power metal vs black metal from a national socialist point of view:

Blues influence - probably a draw
Looks: normal dudes, perhaps historic dress vs disturbing corpsepaint - Power metal wins
Music: well produced, positive, melodies vs badly produced, noisy, negative - Power metal wins
Vocals: clean, operatic vs strange, degenerate - Power metal wins
Live performance: joyful, normal, family friendly vs pigs' heads, self-harm and crucified nudists - Power metal wins
Social: united group of glorious metal warriors vs one man bands and killing band mates - Power metal wins
Popularity: catchy tunes aiming to please vs underground noise ideal - Power metal wins

So, accepting the fact that black metal is far less NS compatible than power metal, what are the real reasons for NSBM?

Copying Varg, who now bashes black metal, and others from the 2nd wave, shock value (as satan got boring) or they actually think that NS is evil and extreme (very non-NS view and subversive) and want to appear evil? Or maybe as it requires less skill, like punk/oi music and being edgy is enough to get some attention? As otherwise the only logical conclusion would be to make power metal (or folk and viking...) as far as metal goes

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acid_bukkake
SAD!

Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:45 am
Posts: 2232
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 6:49 am 
 

The real reasons for NSBM are that there was a vocal pro-NS contingent within the 2nd wave scene, either for shock value or due to legitimate beliefs, and post-WWII followers of NS ideology will take whatever they can get to spread their ideas. Hence NS punk and even pro-NS hip hop (which is the most outlandish one).
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 35180
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 7:06 am 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:
Well, yeah, they've adopted pretty much any aggressive music but black metal still seems one of the odder choices, even when it comes to metal. Let's compare power metal vs black metal from a national socialist point of view:

Blues influence - probably a draw
Looks: normal dudes, perhaps historic dress vs disturbing corpsepaint - Power metal wins
Music: well produced, positive, melodies vs badly produced, noisy, negative - Power metal wins
Vocals: clean, operatic vs strange, degenerate - Power metal wins
Live performance: joyful, normal, family friendly vs pigs' heads, self-harm and crucified nudists - Power metal wins
Social: united group of glorious metal warriors vs one man bands and killing band mates - Power metal wins
Popularity: catchy tunes aiming to please vs underground noise ideal - Power metal wins

So, accepting the fact that black metal is far less NS compatible than power metal, what are the real reasons for NSBM?

Copying Varg, who now bashes black metal, and others from the 2nd wave, shock value (as satan got boring) or they actually think that NS is evil and extreme (very non-NS view and subversive) and want to appear evil? Or maybe as it requires less skill, like punk/oi music and being edgy is enough to get some attention? As otherwise the only logical conclusion would be to make power metal (or folk and viking...) as far as metal goes


Got to say I don't really see the point in this. I guess you might be right, but so what?
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Lee Harrison
Metalhead

Joined: Mon May 30, 2022 6:28 am
Posts: 1433
Location: Italy
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 11:38 am 
 

BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs

I agree with three of four but Gangland don’t like

Worst song of classic era
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Le_Lendemain
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2022 1:43 am
Posts: 13
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 1:04 pm 
 

Having a mindset based on social media.

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Slater922
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:24 pm
Posts: 2342
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 2:09 pm 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:
Well, yeah, they've adopted pretty much any aggressive music but black metal still seems one of the odder choices, even when it comes to metal. Let's compare power metal vs black metal from a national socialist point of view:

Blues influence - probably a draw
Looks: normal dudes, perhaps historic dress vs disturbing corpsepaint - Power metal wins
Music: well produced, positive, melodies vs badly produced, noisy, negative - Power metal wins
Vocals: clean, operatic vs strange, degenerate - Power metal wins
Live performance: joyful, normal, family friendly vs pigs' heads, self-harm and crucified nudists - Power metal wins
Social: united group of glorious metal warriors vs one man bands and killing band mates - Power metal wins
Popularity: catchy tunes aiming to please vs underground noise ideal - Power metal wins

That's a lot of effort to prove that national socialism is better in power metal than black metal, even though the only music genre it belongs in is no genre!

Lee Harrison wrote:
BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs

I agree with three of four but Gangland don’t like

Worst song of classic era

Also, I never really understood the hate for Gangland. While it isn't perfect, I still find it to be a very strong song overall, and certainly not a filler track like many are saying.
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Lee Harrison
Metalhead

Joined: Mon May 30, 2022 6:28 am
Posts: 1433
Location: Italy
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 2:55 pm 
 

Gravetemplar wrote:
Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk would be better without keyboards.

In my opinion Anthems is a classical album and keyboards are the best that I have hear in a metal album..

A Nightside Eclipse sound is reached from other bands but the sound of Anthems never…


Ps Gangland maybe in Piece of mind would sound better but is positioned after Run to the hills and Hallowed by thy name and when came the drop of quality is too evident
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Thy Shrine
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:37 pm
Posts: 1051
Location: Golgotha
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 4:40 pm 
 

Everyone that claims the best song on left hand path is the title track are out of their fucking minds tbh listen to the nihilist demos you chodes lol
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Thy Shrine
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:37 pm
Posts: 1051
Location: Golgotha
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 4:42 pm 
 

Lee Harrison wrote:
Gravetemplar wrote:
Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk would be better without keyboards.

In my opinion Anthems is a classical album and keyboards are the best that I have hear in a metal album..

A Nightside Eclipse sound is reached from other bands but the sound of Anthems never…


Ps Gangland maybe in Piece of mind would sound better but is positioned after Run to the hills and Hallowed by thy name and when came the drop of quality is too evident


Complete fucking bullshit in the nightside Eclipse is by far emperors best
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ZenoMarx
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 11:38 am
Posts: 853
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 4:48 pm 
 

Anyone else think Dimmu Borgir was listening to A LOT of Asia when they made Enthrone Darkness Triumphant?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_(Asia_album)

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Lee Harrison
Metalhead

Joined: Mon May 30, 2022 6:28 am
Posts: 1433
Location: Italy
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 5:25 pm 
 

Thy Shrine wrote:
Lee Harrison wrote:
Gravetemplar wrote:
Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk would be better without keyboards.

In my opinion Anthems is a classical album and keyboards are the best that I have hear in a metal album..

A Nightside Eclipse sound is reached from other bands but the sound of Anthems never…


Ps Gangland maybe in Piece of mind would sound better but is positioned after Run to the hills and Hallowed by thy name and when came the drop of quality is too evident


Complete fucking bullshit in the nightside Eclipse is by far emperors best

I only said that the sound of Nightside Eclipse is reached by other bands

My second fav bm album all time(after Anthems)
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Gemini 7 Rising
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:08 am
Posts: 729
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 9:19 pm 
 

BLMcommunist wrote:
Invaders, Gangland, Quest For Fire and Sun And Steel are great songs


Not sure if it's a "popular" or "unpopular" opinion in the grand scheme of things, but I've never liked Quest For Fire. I think Piece of Mind is a great album (within their top 5) and would be even stronger if they'd just left that song out of there. The chorus especially is just lame, imo, and the lyrics are among their weakest also (at least from the 'classic era').

Sun and Steel is great though.
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~Guest 285196
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:11 pm
Posts: 2187
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 9:28 pm 
 

Invaders is a fun little starter for the album. I would not rate it high on its own. No riff, melody or vocal line really makes it memorable. The only thing it has going for it is being cheesy and fast.

Quest for Fire is a great movie. Not so great song.

Sun and Steel is awesome. Cheesy as hell, but it earns it.

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Rico McPato
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 06, 2020 4:50 pm
Posts: 124
PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2022 11:31 pm 
 

Invaders could 've been a classic but the chorus is awkward. The verses are great.
Sun and Steel is fantastic. Quest for Fire is enjoyable.

Judas Be My Guide was the best song on Fear of the Dark and a lost gem. Purgatory is another classic that time forgot.

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