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LithoJazzoSphere
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 11:36 am 
 

funeralravens wrote:
yungstirjoey666 wrote:
Anyways I like death-doom/gothic-doom, but I'm not a huge fan of traditional doom. I won't say I hate it, but hearing the same Black Sabbath-worshipping riffs singing about weed sounds kinda tiring.

Same. I don't like trad doom like Black Sabbath/Candlemass, but love gothic/death/black/funeral doom.


Yeah, I consider doom one of my favorite subgenres, but to the average metalhead "doom" means trad and stoner. I like a few bands of that variety, but it's not my first preference, so often there isn't a ton of overlap. Not really into drone doom either, and I'm picky about funeral doom.

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mike_87
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 1:10 pm 
 

Deathcore because its a complete mockery of real metal and sounds like absolute shit

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Maggot penetration
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:16 pm
Posts: 274
PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 5:07 pm 
 

Maggot penetration wrote:

Daily upset about "Nazis" aka some trolls or cranky guys in some band somewhere with 0 power whilst being part of the capitalist machinery, eating meat, poisoning the planet, having religious nutters still in power who are seen as respectable, living comfortably in countries that got rich by stealing and murdering, etc....but let's all obsess about a bunch of NS light BM geeks nobody has ever heard of.

It's almost as if somebody trained people to obsess about certain stuff, stuff that needs 0 commitment or sacrifice (unlike going vegetarian or giving up one's car or buying plastic crap etc would). Hey dude, I'm a good capitalist consumer pig but totally against racism. Ok, cool, that will make a difference



The point, dear moderator, is simply that there are real, actual problems in the world that we all could do something about but it actually takes more effort than getting outraged about what's largely a non-issue (that EVERYBODY, even the most exploitative people in power would agree on, that NSBM is bad. It's like making a huge fuss about people with no power and that nobody here would know about without obsessing on it on websites. If someone lives next to an evil NSBM band, fair enough, but otherwise it's no different than to expect radical Islamists or Incels everywhere. Meanwhile those in power are happy to present all of these sorts of people as some major threat and some seem to buy it.

As for how I live, I try to be as far out of the capitalist consumer shit system as possible, without living some recluse life in the woods, after all I proved for a family, but it's not easy, of course. That's why it's an actual task that would need sacrifice, work and cooperation to ever get some real change, something those currently in power (not NS, and very, very unlikely that there will be a NSBM government anywhere soon, it's only the most maligned ideology) try to prevent at all cost


Last edited by hakarl on Fri Aug 05, 2022 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Banned for persistent trolling

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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 5:44 pm 
 

Jeez, weren't you banned for that shit? And now you're bringing it up again?

I'll bite, but not so much to convince you, as you seem to be unredeemable, but because some other people might read your posts and get convinced by stuff that has basically no kind of footing whatsoever.

From the get go, I want to point out that your whole post is based on a false dilemma. You keep assuming that we, the people you engage with in these discussions, do not care about other social, environmental, political issues of any other sorts, which is total bs.

People saying they hate NSBM and fascist shit in their music is not "obsession", and I have yet to find a single compelling argument in favor of "not constantly condemning racism in metal".

Your understanding of power dynamics is also deeply flawed. NSBM bands have power. They have the power of encouraging, supporting, spreading an ideology and making these ideologies less uninhibited. I don't know where you live, but pretty much anywhere in Europe you can find "Nationalists" (read skinheads) marching with their flags, making people of POC as well as homosexuals and trans people feel unsafe in their own neighborhood.

Have you heard of festivals like Asgardsrei? The neo-nazi black metal festival that brings together white supremacists and fascists together to celebrate their racism, promote their ideas and organize in militias, criminalized gangs and whatnot? These are not uncommon, and these are concerning, threatening and actually lead to people taking action, committing hate crimes against POC. And I'm not just talking about Eastern Europe either. Here in Quebec, we have far-right groups like Atalante. And guess what, they have ties with ultra-nationalist and racist bands here. My ex-girlfriend is Morroccan, and she grew up in Quebec City. She told me just how terrible it was within the scene, because these racist pieces of shit are tolerated. And the more they are toletared, the less uninhibited they are about their racist shit.

You keep telling yourself that these are distant issues, non-issues, but the truth is that this is not uncommon. And even if it didn't have direct impacts on us as individuals, why the hell would it change anything? Can we not be concerned for the well-being of other human beings who live across the globe? Can we not be concerned by the fact that there are fascists, ultra-nationalists invading our scene?

I will never not condemn NSBM and racism in black metal. I will not skip opportunities to call it out. And I hope others will keep doing the same, regardless of how "annoying" it is to you.

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Ill-Starred Son
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:18 pm 
 

TheCloudMinder wrote:
I hate death metal, black metal, and anything that sounds like it. Basically all extreme metal.


Do you even like Death?

Afterall, Chuck's vocals really aren't that deep or growly. He's kind of half way between a thrash and death metal singer.

What about Celtic Frost/Hellhammer/Triptykon?

Tom G. Warrior also doesn't really have that deep a growl, and sometimes he sings instead.

And then there's also Possessed, who IMO are more thrash, as well as Kreator who have a singer who definitely growls. IMO Kreator is actually more black-thrash than thrash and I think you could even consider them a 1st wave black metal band.

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LilTito
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Joined: Thu May 13, 2021 3:10 pm
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Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:21 pm 
 

I think power metal is the worst genre of music

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Weerwolf
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Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 7:19 am
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Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 5:20 am 
 

Good riffs are good riffs regardless of the genre.

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Bishop_Drugsalot
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Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:42 am
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:27 am 
 

Weerwolf wrote:
Good riffs are good riffs regardless of the genre.

isn't this the codephrase of an nsbm apologist

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Weerwolf
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Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 7:19 am
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Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:11 pm 
 

Bishop_Drugsalot wrote:
Weerwolf wrote:
Good riffs are good riffs regardless of the genre.

isn't this the codephrase of an nsbm apologist

GBK has great riffs

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Lord_Of_Diamonds
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:24 pm 
 

The question is, how difficult is it for you to excuse the potentially hideous ideologies found in some music if the riffs are just that amazing? If it's not difficult, you might want to question how much you sympathize with the ideology or how many seeds of doubt have been planted in your mind that cause you to question whether or not the suppression of those ideologies in all ways is indeed a good thing.
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TheCloudMinder
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 4:28 pm 
 

@HeavenDuff

It kind of depends on the band. I do like Slayer, but I don't consider them to be a band that has harsh vocals. They are shouty but not growly. Deep guttural growls are a turn-off to me.

From what I heard of Sodom they do not have death metal sounding vocals. They are harsh but they're in a different register.

Dark Angel I honestly don't remember what they sound like.

Kreator...ok, their vocal style does border on those in death metal, and yeah, I do like them to a certain degree in spite of that. But again they are not deep or guttural, so it's a bit different. With that said I'm not really a fan of the album Pleasure to Kill, which borders on death metal. The two albums from them I remember liking were Terrible Certainty and Coma of Souls.

I guess we all just draw the line in different places. For me I like most thrash but as it gets more extreme it becomes kind of a grey area.

When I think of typical thrash metal it sounds markedly different than typical death metal. If you're suggesting that it's illogical to be a fan of thrash metal but not a fan of death metal you're mistaken.

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Twisted_Psychology
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 4:49 pm 
 

It's funny, I actually have more issues than shouted vocals than I do with more extreme metal vocals. Like with a death or black band, apparently I can just pretend the growls or shrieks are just some inhuman monster or something, but a hardcore band with a shouter just sounds like some grown-ass man yelling at me. I've had enough male authority shoved in my face for a lifetime.
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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 4:53 pm 
 

TheCloudMinder wrote:
When I think of typical thrash metal it sounds markedly different than typical death metal. If you're suggesting that it's illogical to be a fan of thrash metal but not a fan of death metal you're mistaken.


No, I never said that. I was trying to figure out what you actually meant by "harsh vocals" because you said you didn't like them, yet you said you liked some bands who clearly have harsh vocals. But you explained just now that you were thinking more of gutturals when you said you didn't like death metal vocals, which is fine by me.

Your initial post seemed to write off all death metal because of the harsh vocals, so yeah, it felt like a contradiction when you said you liked Slayer, Kreator and whatnot, because there is a lot of death metal that features vocals closer to thrash metal style harsh vocals, like those I listed previously, so namely Death, Pestilence, Morbid Angel, Sepultura or Skeletal Remains.

In the end, you're free to like whatever you like. I just had a hard time making sense of what you were saying until you explained yourself better with this last post. However, I still have a hard time with the idea of disliking all death metal because of gutturals, as there are countless examples of non-guttural vocals in death metal.

Sorry if my initial answers to you might have come off as hostile to you particularly. I really do not have any gripe with you as a person. I think we can disagree on something and still have a respectful discussion. Cheers!

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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 4:57 pm 
 

Twisted_Psychology wrote:
It's funny, I actually have more issues than shouted vocals than I do with more extreme metal vocals. Like with a death or black band, apparently I can just pretend the growls or shrieks are just some inhuman monster or something, but a hardcore band with a shouter just sounds like some grown-ass man yelling at me. I've had enough male authority shoved in my face for a lifetime.


That's an interesting take. It's true that most extreme metal vocals are so far removed from how we talk in day-to-day life, that it's easier to perceive it as purely musical or, like you said, somekind of sound an unknown creature would make. On the other hand, hardcore vocals do tend to sound like shouting you could hear in a real fight.

I actually like vocal styles that focus on using our voice in new and interesting way. Like operatic vocals. Nobody talks like that, haha! But it's great that we sing that way.

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Zelkiiro
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:05 pm 
 

Death and black metal would be much more interesting and listenable if the vocals were all done by, like, Tim Aymar and Jens Carlsson, in their normal styles. Or if they were all like the chanted vocals halfway through Summoning's "Land of the Dead."
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LongHairIsSoFuckingCool
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 7:19 pm 
 

Twisted_Psychology wrote:
It's funny, I actually have more issues than shouted vocals than I do with more extreme metal vocals. Like with a death or black band, apparently I can just pretend the growls or shrieks are just some inhuman monster or something, but a hardcore band with a shouter just sounds like some grown-ass man yelling at me. I've had enough male authority shoved in my face for a lifetime.

Like this?
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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:06 pm 
 

Zelkiiro wrote:
Death and black metal would be much more interesting and listenable if the vocals were all done by, like, Tim Aymar and Jens Carlsson, in their normal styles. Or if they were all like the chanted vocals halfway through Summoning's "Land of the Dead."


Fuck no. How can you even imagine that these kinds of vocals would fit, stylistically, with death or black metal? Terrible.

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EvergreenSherbert
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:10 pm 
 

I feel like throat singing fits perfectly with black metal, and should be more popular. Wiegedood already do it.

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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:11 pm 
 

EvergreenSherbert wrote:
I feel like throat singing fits perfectly with black metal, and should be more popular. Wiegedood already do it.



I was listening to this album the other day, and I really like how well the throat singing fits with their music. Good stuff!

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LithoJazzoSphere
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 12:16 am 
 

HeavenDuff wrote:
Zelkiiro wrote:
Death and black metal would be much more interesting and listenable if the vocals were all done by, like, Tim Aymar and Jens Carlsson, in their normal styles. Or if they were all like the chanted vocals halfway through Summoning's "Land of the Dead."


Fuck no. How can you even imagine that these kinds of vocals would fit, stylistically, with death or black metal? Terrible.


Not purely death metal, but stuff like this is pretty cool to me, and I wish more of it existed.

Spoiler: show




Or portions of these:



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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:03 am 
 

Aymar is a tremendous talent, but it would be a boring ass world if there were no harsh vocals or crazy shit that was different.
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klaar
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 4:14 pm 
 

Whatever is that horrible screaming shit Venom Prison is, I don't like that at all

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Twisted_Psychology
Metal freak

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 4:19 pm 
 

LongHairIsSoFuckingCool wrote:
Twisted_Psychology wrote:
It's funny, I actually have more issues than shouted vocals than I do with more extreme metal vocals. Like with a death or black band, apparently I can just pretend the growls or shrieks are just some inhuman monster or something, but a hardcore band with a shouter just sounds like some grown-ass man yelling at me. I've had enough male authority shoved in my face for a lifetime.

Like this?


Yeah, basically that style though Jamey Jasta himself is such a cartoon character at this point that he's probably exempt from that bias. Same goes for a lot of the shouters in thrash, they all sound like cartoons so it's hard to feel all that frazzled by them.
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TheCloudMinder
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2020 9:16 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 4:48 pm 
 

Quote:
However, I still have a hard time with the idea of disliking all death metal because of gutturals, as there are countless examples of non-guttural vocals in death metal.


Yep. Well, I did say that the vocals were mainly the turn-off for me when it comes to death metal, but actually there are other turn-offs as well.

Sometimes I will enjoy some death metal riffs but once the song breaks out into a chaotic blast beat section I really just think it sucks. And this is very typical and common for death metal.

I think much of the guitar playing is really nonsensical. It really sounds to me like much of it is thought up sporadically. Those sections in death metal always make me think to myself what the fuck is this shit. I just hate it with a passion.

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Speed Metal Terror
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:56 pm 
 

Mostly anything with a -core suffix makes my skin crawl and not in a good way.
The biggest culprit in regards to why I dislike it is the vocal approach, which just annoys the shit out of me.

A lot of European Power Metal is awful too.
I enjoy some classic bands and a dozen or so outliers, but it's extremely repellent on average.
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Slater922
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:28 pm 
 

Speed Metal Terror wrote:
A lot of European Power Metal is awful too.
I enjoy some classic bands and a dozen or so outliers, but it's extremely repellent on average.

If you're talking about Sabaton or Powerwolf, then I do see your point. However, besides the obvious classics, you still have some good obscure stuff like Lost Horizon, Falconer, and Nightscape.
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Vadara
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:02 am 
 

The real problem with death/black metal vocals aren't the harsh vocals themselves but the fact that their vocals are almost universally monotone, emotionless, and make very little effort to mesh with the instruments at all. Most death metal vocals sound like they barely belong in the same track, like they made the song as an instrumental first and then just flatly overdubbed vocals over it. I have not heard a single DM/BM band with vocals I would consider earnestly above a 6/10. Deathcore is so far beyond those two genres that its mediocre vocalists blow like every single vocalist in those genres out of the water, real talk.

And of course, as The Black Dahlia Murder shows, any attempt a DM band makes to actually have varied and interesting vocals gets branded "deathcore" and shunned (and they aren't even THAT good!)

Frankly most clean vocals too in metal proper are incredibly corny (there's a reason why PM is infested with stupid meme bands like Gloryhammer, the entire genre sounds inherently goofy as fuck), but it works there better since metal is an inherently theatrical and extra genre.

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Empyreal
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 9:25 am 
 

Have "varied and interesting" vocals if ya want - some of em are just annoying as shit, like TBDM's. I guess I'm just not into anything that's too polished but has harsh vocals. Needs some grime and grit for that in a general rule for me.
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Gravetemplar
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:48 am 
 

I love monotone vocals (for example Gorguts, Ulcerate, Immolation). Most black and death metal would suck with a different vocal approach. Most deathcore vocalists do the same, I don't even know what Vadara is talking about and I don't even hate deathcore.

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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2022 11:42 am 
 

Vadara's take doesn't make sense because it's also stupidly uninformed. Black metal vocals are emotionless? What the fuck are you even listening to to come up with such a terrible take? I can understand calling the more monotone death metal vocals "emotionless" to an extent, but even that is a stretch. Like how are the vocals of Death, Morbid Angel, Devoid of Life or Carcass emotionless? But black metal is emotionless? Black metal vocals are some emotional vocals in metal. Panopticon, Sigh, Enslaved, Mare Cognitum, Primordial, Emperor. No way you listened to any of these and came to the conclusion that they were emotionless.

Like Gravetemplar said, most black and death metal would sound very weird with a different vocal approach.

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Vadara
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 2:40 am 
 

Perhaps calling the "emotionless" is ill-fitting, but I wouldn't call any of the bands you mentioned particularly in-depth vocal wise. They still trade in the trademark style of being theatrical but nonetheless stilted. It's like how power metal vocals are like, *technically* emotional, but frankly so melodramatic they come off as distanced from raw human feeling at the same time.

Metal is just not a genre that lends itself well to raw emotion, frankly, the entire genre is inherently thespian and extra. Which is fine, yeah, and I have no problem listening to some badass riffs and drums but I've never really been one for the vocal styles used across a majority of it.

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LycanthropeMoon
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 2:48 am 
 

The genre being thespian and extra is what draws me to it in the first place, honestly. If I want raw emotion, I tend to go for punk rock or hardcore.

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TheCloudMinder
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 8:52 am 
 

@Vadara

What you said about death metal vocals being monotone and unable to mesh with the instruments makes sense, but then you lost me when you said the same is true of power metal. Power metal singers have wide-ranging, multi-octave voices which makes them capable of meshing melodically with the instruments and expressing a variety of different moods and emotions.

If monotone vocals are problematic for you, then I find it odd you would defend deathcore and bash power metal. The singers in power metal are a lot more versatile than the singers in deathcore.

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HeavenDuff
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 11:13 am 
 

Vadara wrote:
Perhaps calling the "emotionless" is ill-fitting, but I wouldn't call any of the bands you mentioned particularly in-depth vocal wise. They still trade in the trademark style of being theatrical but nonetheless stilted. It's like how power metal vocals are like, *technically* emotional, but frankly so melodramatic they come off as distanced from raw human feeling at the same time.

Metal is just not a genre that lends itself well to raw emotion, frankly, the entire genre is inherently thespian and extra. Which is fine, yeah, and I have no problem listening to some badass riffs and drums but I've never really been one for the vocal styles used across a majority of it.


I don't know that metal being thespian/theatrical makes it less emotional. Sure, it's more rehearsed and less "spur of the moment" then some other genres. But most music is by definition planned and rehearsed. It's a performance. What you said about death, black and even power metal coming off "as distanced from raw human feeling", can apply to basically any musical genre in that regard. Still, I have a hard time understanding how the performances of John Haughm with Agalloch, for instance, could be perceived as anything but genuine and emotional. The man was pourring his heart and soul in his performances. Have you ever tried screaming like, say Esoterica from the band Chaos Moon? It's one of the most liberating and powerful thing you can do, haha!

Still, it's hard to argue with how someone subjectively connects with music. For instance, I can't get into the music of Mariah Cares, for basically the same reasons you stated here for death, black and power metal. It feels to melodramatic, technical and controlled for my tastes, and it makes me feel absolutely nothing. Some people love her stuff though.

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Lumiel
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2021 9:18 am
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 1:12 pm 
 

mike_87 wrote:
Deathcore because its a complete mockery of real metal and sounds like absolute shit


I like the energy of deathcore but it tends to lack substance.
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Fearoth
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:09 am 
 

TheCloudMinder wrote:
@Vadara

What you said about death metal vocals being monotone and unable to mesh with the instruments makes sense, but then you lost me when you said the same is true of power metal. Power metal singers have wide-ranging, multi-octave voices which makes them capable of meshing melodically with the instruments and expressing a variety of different moods and emotions.

If monotone vocals are problematic for you, then I find it odd you would defend deathcore and bash power metal. The singers in power metal are a lot more versatile than the singers in deathcore.


Monotone vocals are the last words I'd use to define modern deathcore. People can hate deathcore all they want but I don't think they're monotone compared to most other genres. There's a reason many bands put the vocals so high in the mix to showcase all the different techniques used, from clean singing, low growls, highs, more hardcore-type shouts and whatever the goblin noises are called.



Spoiler: show

In fact after I listened to more deathcore the last few years, most vocals (unless you listen to bands like Cattle Decapitation) in death/thrash started sounding a bit monotone, although most of the time it does fit the music as they often use less chuggy riffs compared to deathcore.

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Gravetemplar
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2022 3:10 pm 
 

Fearoth wrote:
TheCloudMinder wrote:
@Vadara

What you said about death metal vocals being monotone and unable to mesh with the instruments makes sense, but then you lost me when you said the same is true of power metal. Power metal singers have wide-ranging, multi-octave voices which makes them capable of meshing melodically with the instruments and expressing a variety of different moods and emotions.

If monotone vocals are problematic for you, then I find it odd you would defend deathcore and bash power metal. The singers in power metal are a lot more versatile than the singers in deathcore.


Monotone vocals are the last words I'd use to define modern deathcore. People can hate deathcore all they want but I don't think they're monotone compared to most other genres. There's a reason many bands put the vocals so high in the mix to showcase all the different techniques used, from clean singing, low growls, highs, more hardcore-type shouts and whatever the goblin noises are called.



Spoiler: show

In fact after I listened to more deathcore the last few years, most vocals (unless you listen to bands like Cattle Decapitation) in death/thrash started sounding a bit monotone, although most of the time it does fit the music as they often use less chuggy riffs compared to deathcore.

I know it's not the topic at hand but that first song you posted doesn't have a single element that is related to hardcore (or any -core genre for the matter). Sounds like a mix of ultra polished and technical melodic death metal with some Dimmu Borgir symphonic elements on top.

I don't think the vocals are that varied though, it just sound like they have three different vocalist and each one of them has a different register of monotone vocals. Sure, it's three times more varied but 3x1 is still far from being a 10.

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TheCloudMinder
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 06, 2020 9:16 pm
Posts: 67
PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2022 3:20 pm 
 

I thought the idea was that deathcore was better than other metal because the vocals express raw human emotion unlike the theatrics of other genres?

It doesn't make the case when the vocals include deep beastly grunting and disgusting pig squeals. Not sure how that is supposed to show how deathcore displays more humanlike expressiveness. Those are unnatural sounds unlike normal human singing voices.

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HeavenDuff
Veteran

Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:35 pm
Posts: 3601
Location: Montréal
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2022 11:18 am 
 

The more we're digging into this whole genuine/real/authentic emotions in vocals, the more I feel that everybody needs to remember that no kind of singing whatsoever is like day to day human expression. We are talking about people singing, using rhythms and melodies. All types of vocals can be delivered with emotions, regardless of if they are screamed, shrieked, growled or sang.

Emotions can be conveyed in a multiplicity of ways, and the fact that we listen to music and get moved and feel emotions when people make rhythmic sounds with guitars or pianos, shows that we don't have to find any kind of "real life" reference for it to make sense and connect with us emotionnally. We are humans, we make art and art finds emotionnal resonnance in us on the subjective level.

Deathcore vocals, hardcore vocals, clean singing or whatnot, doesn't have more "authentic emotions" in them compared to death growls, black metal screams or even operatic vocals.

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luis_punisher
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sat May 14, 2022 5:08 pm
Posts: 17
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:40 pm 
 

I don't hate any metal genres, I think that there is good stuff in most genres (of metal, at least). Even nu metal and metalcore have stuff I enjoy like SOAD and Trivium. Then again, I listen mostly to thrash, heavy, death, power, black and prog metal.

But for some reason, there are genres that in my 15 years or so of listening to metal, I haven't really bothered with because I don't find them appealing. Gothic metal, folk metal, stoner, drone (I'm not even sure what is that) and doom metal. However, if someone would play some bands from those genres to me I would probably be able to enjoy them.

It's funny, about doom metal, because Black Sabbath are one of my favorites bands. Besides Danzig, Candlemass, I never really cared to look beyond, they all sound kind of tthe same to me. And I feel that they don't get what made Sabbath great.

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