I am not too sure if there already is a thread on this, but basically what the title says; doesn't necessarily mean that the song is bad or good, but more like it could be improved if we added or deleted some parts. I was inspired to make this thread, because I've just recently listened to Lucifer by Avantasia. Honestly, that song was so amazing, with the build-up, melodies, Jorn's vocals, and overall emotions, but it just ended abruptly; I really wanted to hear more.

As for too long, I still regard Savior in the Clockwork by Avantasia as among the best songs to ever be made, but I think the bridge could be trimmed a bit. I also think some new songs by Iron Maiden could apply. They are great, but sometimes they drag on without getting straight to the point.


So what are your thoughts? What are some metal songs you feel that the length needs to be changed?

I guess Senjutsu got a fair amount of positive reception here, but Maiden didn't need to end the album with 3 10+ minute epics in a row. I think they could have trimmed some fat off of those tracks without sacrificing the epic vibe they were going for.

too short:

Slayer - Reborn & Piece By Piece
Both are awesome barnstormers and probably shouldn't be any longer, but I would be interested in hearing what lengthened versions would sound like.

Maiden - Mother Russia
It's missing a verse! It's great as it is, but it would have been better.

That section is the highlight of the album, IMO. I'd not change a thing.
But I absolutely love what they're doing these days.

I discussed "Mother Russia" in a video on my YouTube channel last year.

Bruce Dickinson's Kill Devil Hill ends way too abruptly. It should be at least seven minutes long, possibly eight or nine.

Most of Master of Puppets could be cut to end right after the first solo in each song. Not an original thought by any means but still very true.

^ Metallica do have loads... The Call of Ktulu (end it sooner), Disposable Heroes (shorten the mid section), The Shortest Straw (cut the second solo bit like they do live), The Judas Kiss (cut some of the solo section), Now That We're Dead (shorten the intro), Spit Out the Bone (cut the shitty slow bit in the middle)... there's more I'm sure. Certainly as time's gone on they've lost the ability to edit their stuff more efficiently (be it song length or album length) but there's earlier examples too.

OP mentioned Avantasia - I'm struggling to think of specifics right now, but there's been a few times on more recent Edguy / Avantasia albums that I've thought the songs ended sooner than I expected. Like where Tobi would've previously had two final choruses, he has only one instead.

Children of Bodom - We're Not Gonna Fall ends quite abruptly. It's not terrible the way it finishes, but always thought it could've been expanded on more.

I see what you did there.

Haha, I honestly wouldn't have noticed if you hadn't have pointed it out.

Too short:

Metallica - For Whom the Bell Tolls. The epic intro really elevates this song, but because the intro is so epic, the song itself is just too short. After the intro it's basically just verse/chorus/verse/chorus/outro. I think another section maybe between the first chorus and second verse could've elevated this song to be one of their best epics ever.

Lordian Guard - Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God. One of the most epic songs I have ever heard and already pretty long, but it deserves a proper ending other than just fading out on the last chorus as it does.

Black Sabbath - Behind the Wall of Sleep. On the The Ozzman Cometh Ozzy compilation, there's a recording of this song from 1969 (as well as a few other Sabbath tunes from the same period), where this version gives this song a nifty outro rather than fading out to NIB as it does on the album. I think this outro makes the song a lot better than the album version.

Skullwinx - Tryst of Destiny. This song is made of what grand epics are made from, but it's not even five minutes long. Good song, but really neutered by its short length.


Too long:

Metallica - Disposable Heroes. Already a great song, but if the song ended right where they ended up beginning the third verse, it'd be about perfect.

Metallica - ...And Justice For All. Way too disjointed and long for the sake of it. One of the main riffs is great though.

Black Sabbath - FX.

Black Sabbath - A National Acrobat. Great song, but the section where the main riff changes a bit and has wah on it needs to be cut shorter.

Black Sabbath - Megalomania. Similarly to A National Acrobat, the section where the song goes to a higher tempo needs to be cut shorter.

Manowar - Achilles.... I actually have a lot less problem with this than most people, for me I would only want the drum solo and the part of the bass solo where the keys drop out to be cut. With those changes it would be one of the best epic heavy metal songs ever.

Reverend Bizarre - Cirith Ungol. Tooooooo long.....

Reverend Bizarre - From the Void. Just cut the drum solo and this would be incredible.

Reverend Bizarre - III: So Long Suckers. Just about every song on this album is way too long.

Sleep - Dopesmoker.

Cathedral - Voyage of the Homeless Sapien. Just cut off the last two minutes or so of goofy shit.

Albert is rolling in his grave and he isn't even dead! Do you even like Reverend Bizarre?

Yes. In the Rectory of the Bizarre Reverend is a great album, other than Cirith Ungol. Harbinger of Metal is great EP/LP, and my only gripe with From the Void is the drum solo. Return to the Rectory is also a great EP/LP. As for the other two full lengths, I'm definitely not as enthused as I am the other releases I just named, and the biggest problem with III is they made the songs way too long for the sake of it.

I mean I named the same amount of Black Sabbath tracks as too long and Sabbath is my favorite band of all time.

I named a few Metallica songs, but I think Justice is one of the longer songs where they get it spot on. I've never felt that one overstayed its welcome. Same with Megalomania - I think Sabbath get that just right.

I guess many know these two Maiden "epics": 'For the Greater Good of God' & 'The Red and the Black' (these two are my main choices)... Mostly so great parts, but repeated way too much. The first takes ages to hit the fantastic chorus, for example. As mentioned a milion times before, repetition is not how to create progressive stuff. I mean something like 'Rime of the Ancient Mariner' & 'Dance of Death' are magnificent musical stories. That's how working epics are done.

I.M.'s 'Prophecy' contains fantastic, ancient-sounding acoustic guitar part, and I wanted way more of that on that song or that fantastic album the song is included in!

One of the best bits Battlelore ever created are at the end of 'Ocean's Elysium' song. That fantastic lead guitar melody last for 11 seconds before mutating into a solo, more like. But that melody is so strong and magnificent, that I do not understand how they use it only TWICE. It could have re-emerged after the solo... Shame.

Dragonforce's Ultra Beatdown would have been their best if it weren't for the needless, momentum-killing interludes in a lot of the songs. Taking a break from 300bpm madness is fine if you do it right, but taking a complete 180 and doing the shit they do on some of those tracks is enough for me to turn them off midway through. It sucks though, because the choruses and ideas present on most of those tracks are their best.

About a song being too long to me, the first case that came to mind was that it would be better if the atmospheric "winter sounds"/ambient non-metal intro/outro parts on certain metal songs by Paysage d'Hiver were a bit shorter.

I am also not a fan of long parts with guitar solos in general - so a metal song is usually better for me when there is no a guitar solo at all or when a solo part/parts is/are relatively short (for example, certain songs by Decoryah have parts with guitar solos that are too long for me).

About 80% of Maidens reunion era output is way too long

It's been mentioned multiple times already (which means I'm not alone in my assertion) but Disposable Heroes is always the first track that comes to mind with this argument

Type O - Haunted

First four minutes are brutal doom-gaze-goth sexiness. And then it goes into the spoken word section and then just endless repitition.

this makes me think of be my druidess - the "i'd do anything to make you come/cum(?)" repetition is pretty damn annoying

Another one for Type O - She Burned Me Down.

"Every time I see her start a fire
I get higher"

That could be cut down a bit.

Agree with burned me down and druidess! They always self produced - I wonder if an outside producer would have helped them trim down a lot of the bloat and fat from several of their songs!

Chopped in half by Obituary. way way to short.

Bruce

Bro, do you even doom?

Yes, yes I do.

Not sure why you kept Cathedral in that post, the part I wanted cut was "Take a bite.... of the Twix! Your boobies.... are inside out! *toilet flushes*"

I just kept all the doom tracks. Don't read too much into it

X Japan's Art of Life does not need to be as long as it is. It's got a piano segment that is like 25% fine and then 75% unnecessarily long and chaotic. I don't care if it's meant to match the themes or any of that nonsense, it's annoying. I have similar feelings toward Manowar's "Achilles, Agony and Ecstasy". So much padded bullshit in that thing.

Any song that has extended silence at the end just so there's some sample, trickery, goofing off, or hidden track that wasn't worth sitting through all that silence for.

Definitely "Bleed" by Meshuggah, which should've ended by around the 5 minute mark, instead of lingering for over another 2 like it did (thankfully, they cut it down to the former length for the video, so I prefer to listen to that version).

90% of Vital Remains songs from Dechristianize and Icons of Evil are just them literally playing the song twice. There's no reason for half those songs to be over 7 minutes long...

Leave Master Of Puppets alone, it's a perfect album just the way it is.

I'd just shorten Maidens discography by cutting them off entirely from '92 at the latest. No fucking around editing, just chop it off there.

'The angel and the gambler' is far too short, needs more chorus.

^While you're at it, throw in some more of those awesome keys too. Then repeat for another 10 minutes, that should do.

Same album as The Angel and the Gambler, we have:

Don't look to
Don't look to
Don't look to the eyes of a stranger...

I've said this before, but the end of Sorcerer's Pledge by Candlemass is way too short.

I challenge you all to name more songs that are too short. Like, genuinely, not like The Angel and the Wanker...

So Be It by Anaal Nathrakh

just my opinion, though...someone else may very well feel differently

Damn, I think that song is perfect the way it is, though I'm not sure if this idea would be much of detriment either.

As is it's so damn epic and perfect, it took me decades to even realize it doesn't have a guitar solo. And you know what? It doesn't need one.

I don't know if this fits into the thread (and it's very subjective anyway): there are a few soft slow/mid-tempo non-metal songs with clean/acoustic guitars (for example, the song "Empirical Choirs" by Mournful Congregation) on certain metal albums where I would like the songs to be a little longer by adding to them a few parts with melodic lines by distorted electric guitars in the style of melodic guitar playing on October Tide's debut album or by adding some slightly more depressive parts with slow tempo guitar riffs similar to the beginnings of the songs "Funereal Owlblood" and "3rd Nocturnal Prayer" by Bethlehem.


There are so many examples like this - when the second half/the ending of a song is too long and too repetitive and could be made a little shorter.
Verdunkeln is a band that uses repetition a lot in general, but on the song "Der Herrscher" (which is quite long in itself, even without that last part) they 'outdid' themselves and made the ending of the song ~2.5 minutes length and very repetitive, with a very simple mid tempo rhythm and with that one recurring theme that started on 12.13 ...
(The final song "Auf freiem Felde" on that album, on the other hand, could be a bit longer by adding to it a short guitar solo/or by adding just some lead guitar line (with higher-pitched notes) - in a style of the slower lead guitar line (at ~5.35) on Bathory's "Baptised in Fire and Ice" for example - especially since it seems that Verdunkeln already used the album "Hammerheart" as inspiration for many of the slower parts for the album "Einblick in den Qualenfall").

The Hills Have Eyes off of Dopethrone is a really cool instrumental jam. It'd be nice if it lasted longer than 47 seconds.

I wish sleeping village by black sabbath would've extended into an acoustic slow ballad type of song

I think megalomania is a little repetitive too after about the third time of repeating the admittedly badass riff I Start actively noticing it every time it's a shame cuz the build up is quite the shit