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Oberst_Orlok_SS
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Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:09 am
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Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 8:49 am 
 

Alice In Chains were one of my favorite bands in the 1990s. All the albums from that era are nothing short of amazing, and Layne Staley’s vocals embodied much of themes that went into the music. I was a fan of this band so much so that I refused to give the new incarnation of the band a chance. I thought that without Layne, there really wasn’t much of a point.

What are your thoughts on the material and shows with the newer singer? How do the recordings measure up next to Facelift and Dirt in terms of metal?
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Xymosys
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:19 am
Posts: 661
Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 9:43 am 
 

The classics are always gonna be classics! But, the "freshly" reunited AIC sound just as massive and grandiose. And when it comes to vocals, the new guy surely knows how to deliver with power! I was completely caught off the guard and blown away when the Black Gives Way to Blue came out. Such power, man!
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Gravetemplar
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Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
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Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 9:51 am 
 

Black Gives Way to Blue is great. The next two albums are also cool but they got a lukewarm reception because they weren't as good. They should keep their albums shorter though. Love this one:


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InnesI
The Goat Fucker

Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
Posts: 1883
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 10:00 am 
 

Oberst_Orlok_SS wrote:
Alice In Chains were one of my favorite bands in the 1990s. All the albums from that era are nothing short of amazing, and Layne Staley’s vocals embodied much of themes that went into the music. I was a fan of this band so much so that I refused to give the new incarnation of the band a chance. I thought that without Layne, there really wasn’t much of a point.

What are your thoughts on the material and shows with the newer singer? How do the recordings measure up next to Facelift and Dirt in terms of metal?


My favourite albums from Alice in Chains are the Alice in Chains, Jar of Flies and Black Gives Way to Blue. The comeback is a monster album. Really, really good. The other two didn't stick with me as much even though they have some good material on them.

Many think Layne's vocals were the most important thing in Alice in Chains but I think what really makes their music unique is the songwriting of Jerry as well as the vocal harmonies he does. Layne's vocals were great but not essential. Give the new stuff a chance, at the very least the comeback album.
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wizard_of_bore
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 4:17 pm
Posts: 655
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 10:18 am 
 

AIC, is also my favorite band from 1990s. Well more specifically the 1990s, that style. Rock/Grunge/Alternative/Heavy Metal whatever you want to call it. I like their stuff quite a bit with Layne on vocals, it is very difficult for me to listen to them with another vocalist. I listened to them when Facelift came out and followed their entire short lived career. Being with them from the start, it is really is difficult for me to listen to them with someone else on vocals. I do like a song here or there by them with William on vocals, overall though it doesn't seem to do it for me. Something in the chemistry of the music isn't there. I believe Layne brought this dark element to the music. Its not there with William on vocals.
I am happy for them that they are still doing music. If people enjoy it, I am all for it.
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Metal_On_The_Ascendant
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Joined: Fri May 22, 2015 6:38 am
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 11:40 am 
 

The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here is my personal favorite of the post-Staley stuff. Admittedly, I haven't spent much time with Rainier Fog but I be remember it being consistent on first sampling. TDPDH is a very wholesome record; hazy and vibey but also strongly riffy. Jerry sings a lot on there, he and William DuVall do the classic vocal harmonizing AiC is known for and they sound really good.
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InnesI
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Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 11:53 am 
 

Metal_On_The_Ascendant wrote:
The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here is my personal favorite of the post-Staley stuff. Admittedly, I haven't spent much time with Rainier Fog but I be remember it being consistent on first sampling. TDPDH is a very wholesome record; hazy and vibey but also strongly riffy. Jerry sings a lot on there, he and William DuVall do the classic vocal harmonizing AiC is known for and they sound really good.


The title track on that album is one of my favourite Alice in Chains songs ever!
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Evoken
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 11:02 am
Posts: 884
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 12:02 pm 
 

I'm glad they decided to continue the band after Layne died. Jerry wrote most of the material for the band anyway and has always performed back up (and some lead) vocals, so the new material still sounds like AIC just without Layne's vocals. William DuVall was also a very good fit, as he doesn't try to copy Layne but easily can sing what he did and his voice blends well with Jerry's. In my opinion, AIC is one of the few instances of a band coming back after a break-up and with a new frontman and it working. But I get the people that miss Layne and it just not being the same without him.

I do think that Black Gives Way to Blue is considerably better than the 2 albums that followed it. The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here and Rainier Fog are very solid albums, but they don't feel as special.

My one complaint about DuVall-era AIC is that I wish the band would experiment a bit more. I'd love for them to write more weird or unique songs, or more mellow ones like they did when Layne was around. Rainier Fog especially felt like a band putting out a well-written but completely safe, paint-by-numbers modern AIC album with almost no surprises.

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Oddeye
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:24 pm
Posts: 2224
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 5:10 pm 
 

Man you at least need to give Black Gives Way To Blue a chance. It's such a great fuckin' album and the title track is one of the best songs the band has written.

For some reason The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here never stuck with me but Rainier Fog is rock solid as well.

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 6:06 pm 
 

Black Gives Way to Blue has the better standalone tracks - "Last of My Kind" fucking rips. But I think Rainier Fog is the more consistent one and despite seeming sort of also-ran, it grew on me a lot. The title song and "Red Giant" rule especially.

They don't really go all out like they did on their best works in the old days but it's cool they're still around and putting out rock solid albums.
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Napalm_Satan
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Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:27 pm
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Location: London, England, United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 7:31 pm 
 

Black Gives Way to Blue is one of my favourite metal and comeback albums of all time; it is a masterful, captivating work that I would put on the level of their classic material any day. The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here is a similar story; hampered a little bit by its length I feel but otherwise incredible too. Rainier Fog... is fine. I want to revisit it but I'm not nearly as crazy about it, it does sound a bit also ran compared to how revitalised and grand its predecessors felt.
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tahu157
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:22 pm
Posts: 755
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 7:34 pm 
 

In the words of my friend, Black Gives Way to Blue is "heavier than concrete shoes."

Empyreal wrote:
Black Gives Way to Blue has the better standalone tracks - "Last of My Kind" fucking rips.

Came here to post that exact track.


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DMac77
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:08 pm
Posts: 74
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 12:48 am 
 

I'll echo a lot of other posters as a big Alice in Chains fan, the post Layne albums are great. I've always considered Cantrell the heart of the band and Duvall has been a great addition.

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Rodman
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2011 10:15 am
Posts: 620
Location: Sydney, Australia
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 2:57 am 
 

InnesI wrote:
Oberst_Orlok_SS wrote:
Alice In Chains were one of my favorite bands in the 1990s. All the albums from that era are nothing short of amazing, and Layne Staley’s vocals embodied much of themes that went into the music. I was a fan of this band so much so that I refused to give the new incarnation of the band a chance. I thought that without Layne, there really wasn’t much of a point.

What are your thoughts on the material and shows with the newer singer? How do the recordings measure up next to Facelift and Dirt in terms of metal?


My favourite albums from Alice in Chains are the Alice in Chains, Jar of Flies and Black Gives Way to Blue. The comeback is a monster album. Really, really good. The other two didn't stick with me as much even though they have some good material on them.


I never thought I'd see the day where someone listed their three favourite AIC albums, and Dirt wasn't mentioned.
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InnesI
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Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
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PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 5:19 am 
 

Rodman wrote:
I never thought I'd see the day where someone listed their three favourite AIC albums, and Dirt wasn't mentioned.


For me it's a little bit to much rock. I was always drawn to their more metal side (the self titled) or their more melancholic side (Jar of Flies). But I like all of the other Layne albums as well. They just don't resonate with me as much as the ones mentioned.
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Everflowingstream
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:29 am
Posts: 546
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 6:08 am 
 

Probably listen to the post Layne albums more often. Really good music.

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DeadKid
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:51 am
Posts: 287
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 6:33 am 
 

Both times I saw them live were at festivals with the new singer. The sound was quite bad the 2nd time, but the 1st time was brilliant. They wouldn't have been as good without Jerry contributing vocals though. I haven't spent enough time with the studio recordings.

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MalignantTyrant
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2011 3:27 pm
Posts: 1237
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 7:32 am 
 

Personally, I loved The Devil Put Dinosaurs Here. It was a fantastically dreary and well written album.
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Gravetemplar
Veteran

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 2663
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 8:29 am 
 

Rodman wrote:
InnesI wrote:
Oberst_Orlok_SS wrote:
Alice In Chains were one of my favorite bands in the 1990s. All the albums from that era are nothing short of amazing, and Layne Staley’s vocals embodied much of themes that went into the music. I was a fan of this band so much so that I refused to give the new incarnation of the band a chance. I thought that without Layne, there really wasn’t much of a point.

What are your thoughts on the material and shows with the newer singer? How do the recordings measure up next to Facelift and Dirt in terms of metal?


My favourite albums from Alice in Chains are the Alice in Chains, Jar of Flies and Black Gives Way to Blue. The comeback is a monster album. Really, really good. The other two didn't stick with me as much even though they have some good material on them.


I never thought I'd see the day where someone listed their three favourite AIC albums, and Dirt wasn't mentioned.

You know what? I think I like post-Laine albums better than the "classic" AIC albums. The thing is I'm not a great grunge fan so this new approach which s bit more "metallic" and "sludgy" works better for me. Dirt for example has a very strong "stoner" feeling to it and I'm not really interesting into that sound.

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hallowed78
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 4:53 am
Posts: 334
Location: LV-426
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 8:44 am 
 

Gravetemplar wrote:
You know what? I think I like post-Laine albums better than the "classic" AIC albums.


I'm in that camp too. Not wanting to take away anything from the classic albums, they are really good and get played from time to time, but the new ones are much closer to the sound I appreciate. On that note, Breath on a Window is my favorite AIC song, it's just a fantastic track start to finish.

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Oberst_Orlok_SS
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:09 am
Posts: 409
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 9:15 am 
 

InnesI wrote:
Rodman wrote:
I never thought I'd see the day where someone listed their three favourite AIC albums, and Dirt wasn't mentioned.


For me it's a little bit to much rock. I was always drawn to their more metal side (the self titled) or their more melancholic side (Jar of Flies). But I like all of the other Layne albums as well. They just don't resonate with me as much as the ones mentioned.


Have you heard that album all the way through? It’s heavier than Metallica’s Black Album.
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ThePoop
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PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 9:39 am 
 

Nothing beats the Layne era for me, but I do enjoy the three post-Layne albums. I think if you combined some select highlights from the three you'd have possibly the best AIC album, but they don't come close to stacking up to anything before them on their own.
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InnesI
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Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
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PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 9:55 am 
 

Oberst_Orlok_SS wrote:
InnesI wrote:
Rodman wrote:
I never thought I'd see the day where someone listed their three favourite AIC albums, and Dirt wasn't mentioned.


For me it's a little bit to much rock. I was always drawn to their more metal side (the self titled) or their more melancholic side (Jar of Flies). But I like all of the other Layne albums as well. They just don't resonate with me as much as the ones mentioned.


Have you heard that album all the way through? It’s heavier than Metallica’s Black Album.


I'm very familiar with all Layne studio albums (and I got into the band in 1994 so it's not a case of me getting acquainted with them through the later stuff). As someone above mentioned their early stuff was more in that rock sound and feel. And a little bit stoner(ish) sonically. I just prefer their middle period starting from the self titled.
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Twisted_Psychology
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Joined: Sat May 16, 2009 8:22 pm
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PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 4:14 pm 
 

Black Gives Way To Blue is just as strong as the classics in my eyes and while the subsequent two are a slight step down, they're both still incredibly enjoyable albums. They seem to directly hone in on their doom metal influences and seeing more focus on Cantrell's pleasant voice and powerful riff game is always welcome. At this point, I really want to release another Jar of Flies-style EP.

I also find it funny how Jerry Cantrell's solo stuff sounded like Alice In Chains but now the AIC stuff sounds like solo Jerry Cantrell. Rainier Fog in particular channels a lot of Boggy Depot. It's very cyclical.
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Oberst_Orlok_SS
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Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:09 am
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Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2021 10:23 pm 
 

Yeah T_P, I thought that too. Some of the material on Boggy Depot was supposedly written for what would’ve been the next Alice In Chains record with Staley. Some of the tone seems to imply that intention. I have Degradation Trip laying around somewhere which I’ll have to dig up.


Last edited by Oberst_Orlok_SS on Mon May 24, 2021 4:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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marktheviktor
Metal freak

Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:41 am
Posts: 6727
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 4:36 pm 
 

Jerry wrote and still writes most of the material anyway, however I can understand the reverence for the Staley period because of his voice and transparency in the last performances.

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Psychedelicatessen
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon May 17, 2021 7:58 pm
Posts: 24
PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 6:55 pm 
 

DuVall has been with the band for awhile now, and I still see Karen-types cursing this man's very existence; even though most of these people probably couldn't differentiate between Cantrell's vocals and Layne's vocals if it came down to it.

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Fearoth
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:09 pm
Posts: 92
PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 10:19 pm 
 

Am I the only one who thinks Duvall sounds way too similar to Jerry? Other than that I still love most of their new material, Jerry is really good at what he does.

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Durag
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Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 1:51 pm
Posts: 114
Location: Republic Of Ireland
PostPosted: Tue May 25, 2021 2:10 am 
 

To be honest, black gives way to blue might be my favourite Alice in chains album. The next two are enjoyable enough but a huge step down but I'm not a great fan of their debut album album either.

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Dr_Fiemost
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Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:19 pm
Posts: 105
PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2021 4:56 am 
 

My complain with their latest work, like with Cantrell's solo albums, is that there are to many fillers, while the first era AiC were more on point.
Maybe Staley were able to make everything sound great or he was more selective but there is no song that sound useless or is easily forgotten in the old albums.
Anyway they still sound great for such a long standing band.
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Dungeon_Vic
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:00 am
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Location: Greece
PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2021 5:10 am 
 

+1 for Black Gives Way to Blue. EXCELLENT. As already mentioned, the vocal harmonies between Jerry and DuVall are 100% AiC, although I do not agree that Layne wasn't special, you will not find anything like the verses of Rooster for example (and yeah, OF COURSE Dirt is the best, silly people!).

Basically, anything AiC is at least good and usually fucking awesome. Well worth looking into the reunion albums.
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marktheviktor
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PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2021 3:36 pm 
 

Jerry and Layne’s vocals were similar enough when they harmonized and it worked beautifully, but Staley was inimitable in the lead with some of those songs, ex. Down in a Hole.

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Pelata
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Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 3:16 pm
Posts: 170
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 9:11 pm 
 

Post-Layne AIC isn't terrible. By the end, JC had began coming forward as a co-lead vocalist even more than he had earlier, so the shift to WD doesn't sound hugely different.

That said, Layne Stayley was in a class by himself. Absolutely brilliant singer.

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Yuli Ban
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Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:07 am
Posts: 147
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2021 6:38 pm 
 

InnesI wrote:
I'm very familiar with all Layne studio albums (and I got into the band in 1994 so it's not a case of me getting acquainted with them through the later stuff). As someone above mentioned their early stuff was more in that rock sound and feel. And a little bit stoner(ish) sonically. I just prefer their middle period starting from the self titled.

Dirt (as in the song on the album) is a straight up traditional-doom metal track (it flummoxes me more people don't hear it), and I think you could definitely make an argument that Facelift is the only glam metal/doom metal fusion album ever made. There wasn't really any sort of sound like it at the time, which is why they were considered "alternative metal" (a term nowadays that basically just refers to quasi-metalcore/nü metal/post-grunge but at the time referred to actual metal bands that didn't fit neatly into any of the traditional or burgeoning extreme subgenres). Considering that grunge and stoner rock are sister genres (something else I'm flummoxed more people don't recognize), it makes perfect sense AiC went in the direction they did. Modern AiC is quite literally straight sludge metal, like a less bizarro Melvins.

They were certainly more diverse in sound in the early 90s, and their aesthetic certainly pioneered the 90s dark alternative scene that would be exploited to Hell and back by nü metal and industrial rock artists even though they sounded like a weirdo, super-drugged out first-wave metal band from the late 70s. Just like my feelings about Rage Against the Machine as compared to (almost) every rap-rock artist that followed, Chains showed us you could do the Edgy 90s with actual rifftastic heavy rock swagger rather than stripping down everything to chug and rage-whine all the time, and I still can't tell you why the sound of heavy alternative music shifted from that '70s throwback style circa 91 through 94 to that Douche Age style by '98. I'm just glad we got Alice in Chains in there. It's hilarious to hear "old school alternative metal" playlists play these doomy riffs in between Korntastic breakdowns and whatever Finger Eleven, Breaking Point, and Drowning Pool were.

But the reason why their older stuff was so rockish was because that was the tradition they came out of, especially Layne.
After all, before there was Alice in Chains, there was Alice N Chainz...

Skipedeebopdebeboopedeebum!

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Twisted_Psychology
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2021 3:51 pm 
 

Yuli Ban wrote:
I think you could definitely make an argument that Facelift is the only glam metal/doom metal fusion album ever made.


I'd argue that the Tony Martin-era Sabbath albums have the same fusion with some extra power metal flavor but to your point, Facelift really does have its own vibe.
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