Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives

Message board

* FAQ    * Register   * Login 



Reply to topic
Author Message Previous topic | Next topic
MRmehman
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 1:34 pm
Posts: 525
Location: Painted World of Ariamis
PostPosted: Sun May 16, 2021 8:27 pm 
 

Hey everyone. A number of years ago, I had a short talk with a friend about how funeral doom developed, what an anomaly it is in comparison to other metal genres and which genres it sounds most like. One thing neither of us could agree on was which genre acts as the main influence for funeral doom bands and which genres sounded the closest to funeral doom: death metal, doom metal or none of the above.

Given Skepticism (one of the genre's earliest bands) sounded very similar to death metal on their demo and that a lot of funeral doom musicians got their start playing in death metal bands, I concluded funeral doom riffs are most similar to death metal in their structure and sound. Of course, I'd also say funeral doom riffs just sound closest to death or death doom bands. He on the other hand felt funeral doom riffs stood apart from other genres and the similarities were superficial.

I've heard others argue still that funeral doom is: an extension of doom metal; with its riff effectively being Tony Iommi-worship played at its absolute slowest, stoner or sludge metal; usually these arguments make comparisons with bands like Sleep and Cathedral, and drone music; where people mostly compare funeral doom's experimental and avant-garde nature, not to mention its slowness. That last case certainly applies to bands like Oak and Bell Witch.

What exactly has influenced the majority of funeral doom bands? Is funeral doom even the most accurate way to describe the genre? What do you think? I personally love funeral doom but I'm not too well versed in its history and development. I'm sure there's someone out there who could tell me the exact demo tape from 1987 that all these bands are ripping their stuff off from. (haha)
_________________
"He who is tired of Candlemass, is tired of life."

Top
 Profile  
Morn Of Solace
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:19 am
Posts: 2246
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 2:38 am 
 

Very early Paradise Lost (demos like Frozen Illusion, that circulated heavily) and Cathedral's first album must surely have been an influence, a lot of their riffs could really fit in the genre when heavily slowed down. The guys in Thergothon also referenced Black Sabbath, dark ambient and gothic rock as influences for their Stream From The Heavens, which is probably the earliest album of it's kind. Those influences, among the intuition of slowing heavily down the songs are probably at the core of the genre.

I think Doom it's still the correct way to define it: the extreme slowness may be misleading but lots of riffs even from modern bands still retain their doom / death-doom DNA even when it's mixed with various influences from other kinds of non-metal music like dark ambient, post-rock...

Top
 Profile  
Terri23
Veteran

Joined: Thu Sep 30, 2010 3:53 am
Posts: 2718
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 3:05 am 
 

Mournful Congregation were huge fans of My Dying Bride.
_________________
metaldiscussor666 wrote:
American isn't a nationality

Riffs wrote:
It's been scientifically proven that appreciating Black Sabbath helps increase life expectancy, improves happiness, bumps your salary by 11 thousand dollars annually, helps fight cavities and increases penis size.

Top
 Profile  
Zerberus
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 4:29 pm
Posts: 1780
Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 3:45 am 
 

I definitely don't think of funeral doom as a direct continuation of traditional doom metal. The sound of bands like Pentagram, Black Sabbath and Saint Vitus (in my opinion) evolved more into stoner metal (you can not convince me that Kyuss and Fu Manchu don't sound like Black Sabbath).

I'm no authority on the subject, and I rarely listen to funeral doom metal, but to me its closest cousin is death-doom, but many bands in the genre have a distinct black metal aesthetic (musically and visually) thrown in too. So my guess would be that most of it evolved from slowed down death metal paired with the mystical, occultist leanings of black metal. Gothic rock/post-punk and such may also have slightly influenced the gloomy atmosphere early on.
_________________
TONEwood Music: Buy tapes, live forever
Listen to BONEJAMMER

Top
 Profile  
goetia_unreleased
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 5:35 pm
Posts: 51
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 8:21 am 
 

Morn Of Solace wrote:
Very early Paradise Lost (demos like Frozen Illusion, that circulated heavily) and Cathedral's first album must surely have been an influence, a lot of their riffs could really fit in the genre when heavily slowed down.

The Evoken cover of Rotting Misery comes to mind.
_________________
elitist / n. 1. person with ostentatious likes and dislikes based on pretentious standards of excellence.

Top
 Profile  
Pitiless Wanderer
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:34 pm
Posts: 1420
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 8:28 am 
 

The realm of unending boredom, I'd guess.

Top
 Profile  
Ball Cupper
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 7:51 pm
Posts: 167
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 9:57 am 
 

probably more accurate to call is "funeral death", considering the predominant influences
_________________
\,,/(◣_◢)\,,/ ~piss baby~ \,,/(◣_◢)\,,/

Top
 Profile  
Gravetemplar
Veteran

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 2637
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 10:46 am 
 

Depends on the band honestly. Esoteric and Skepticism sound nothing alike.

Top
 Profile  
Metal_On_The_Ascendant
Metalhead

Joined: Fri May 22, 2015 6:38 am
Posts: 1168
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 10:49 am 
 

Ball Cupper wrote:
probably more accurate to call is "funeral death", considering the predominant influences


"funeral death" sounds dumb, come on

I don't know the exact history either but I'm thinking whatever death metal bands influenced funeral doom, they were of the doomy quality; Incantation, Winter, even Bolt Thrower and Asphyx and so on. My point being they still took the bulk of the stylistic influence from Doom metal because of the slow tempos and wretched atmosphere.
_________________
EldritchSun wrote:
Bands are do music way too close to others to get recognized as "X genre" bands are fucking mediocre. Do Metallica's riffs sound Kreator's riffs? no!

Top
 Profile  
Sathanas_BM
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:55 am
Posts: 349
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 11:04 am 
 

I think it’s safe to say it comes from an amalgamation of several places. For example, while obviously it’s not THE sole source of inspiration for funeral doom, I wouldn’t be surprised if at least a few bands took a queue from the song “Suspended In Dusk” by Type O Negative. It’s a bonus track on Bloody Kisses, released in ‘93. Normally with it being a bonus track and all, I’d doubt it’d have enough visibility to influence an entire subgenre, but I mean... when you hear the song, it’s pretty shocking really. I don’t know, Type O was pretty huge, so I don’t think it’s entirely out of the realm of possibility. As a late comer to Type O but a long time appreciator of funeral doom and death/doom, I was pretty blown away at just how crushing the song is and how many similarities it shared.
_________________
EntilZha wrote:
Go ahead and try to disprove that fact with your flying spaghetti monsters you atheist heathens.


thepoopsmithmaster wrote:
cultofkraken wrote:
Are you that dense?
Define dense.

Top
 Profile  
MRmehman
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 1:34 pm
Posts: 525
Location: Painted World of Ariamis
PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2021 1:54 pm 
 

Morn Of Solace wrote:
Very early Paradise Lost (demos like Frozen Illusion, that circulated heavily) and Cathedral's first album must surely have been an influence, a lot of their riffs could really fit in the genre when heavily slowed down. The guys in Thergothon also referenced Black Sabbath, dark ambient and gothic rock as influences for their Stream From The Heavens, which is probably the earliest album of it's kind. Those influences, among the intuition of slowing heavily down the songs are probably at the core of the genre.

I absolutely hear how those first two bands impacted the development of funeral doom. There's an "uglyness" reflected across the genre and Cathedral are one of the first bands I can think of who had those distinctly weird or unappealing riffs - save for the venerable Celtic Frost of course. That's a really good point to make too: Thergothon really don't sound like the majority of funeral doom bands from the same era due to their odd range of influences. There's absolutely a strong gothic/dark ambient tint to Stream From the Heavens that the rest of the genre doesn't really share.
Terri23 wrote:
Mournful Congregation were huge fans of My Dying Bride.

It's probably time for me to really listen to early MDB. I'm more familiar with their mid/later output. Sounds like spending some time with their early shit would go a long way to understanding where exactly funeral doom came from.
Metal_On_The_Ascendant wrote:
Ball Cupper wrote:
probably more accurate to call is "funeral death", considering the predominant influences


"funeral death" sounds dumb, come on

I don't know the exact history either but I'm thinking whatever death metal bands influenced funeral doom, they were of the doomy quality; Incantation, Winter, even Bolt Thrower and Asphyx and so on. My point being they still took the bulk of the stylistic influence from Doom metal because of the slow tempos and wretched atmosphere.

Does funeral death metal really sound all that much sillier than funeral doom metal? as an aside, can we come up with a better name than death/doom?

Asphyx I would absolutely say had a huge impact on the genre, as did death/doom in general. Anytime I put something like Mythic on, I instantly cast a glance towards my funeral doom CDs and see the similarities.
_________________
"He who is tired of Candlemass, is tired of life."

Top
 Profile  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Dungeon_Vic, thebloodfeaster, wrathchild_88 and 30 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

  Print view
Jump to:  

Back to the Encyclopaedia Metallum


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group