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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 5:06 pm 
 

All good points. I can't really connect with a lot of the mainstream culture anymore even when I like plenty of shit that gets popular enough. Just don't care to keep up with the constant manufacturing treadmill of superhero movies and Harry Potter shit. I liked all that stuff when I was 10. I've since found other more adult shit that's way cooler to me now. Nothing wrong with not being adult, but yeah I do think the mainstream suffocating nature of HP and all that is why metal acts aren't writing about it.

Quote:
Idk i just find nothing more irritating than the new "civilized" clean "intellectually minded" culture that by the way still costs a fucking fortune to even be a part of, it's fake and disingenuous to me.


It's all a lot of stuff about how everything should be positive now. Lots of folks don't want to be challenged or see complex shit.

blackdiamond74 wrote:
I think a lot of it is nostalgia from, what they perceive, as a bygone era. And it's comfortable, safe and requires little effort since they're already invested in it. I don't think it's a whole lot different than an 80s metal head only listening to output from that era, and it's a good one, and dismissing anything thereafter.


True, though 80s metal fortunately does not have a giant mega corporation trying to shove it down everyone's throats as a new monoculture. That's what makes this other stuff more insidious to me.
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Thy Shrine
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 5:49 pm 
 

Oh yeah it's frustrating hearing total normies talk about their generic fuckin taste as if it's high intellectual art, reminds me of high school.

Tho of course theres a certain subsect that's basically the same thing but now the aesthetic just changes like the death grips fans or the Anthony fantano type of thing, just going super "underground" but with the obnoxious nerd/intellectual superior aura to it. I think that shits so stupid

And usually you hear something generally more intelligent in things and people that are usually low key and unassuming, not in cheap fads
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HeavenDuff
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:35 pm
Posts: 5165
Location: Montréal
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:32 pm 
 

Thy Shrine wrote:
Idk i just find nothing more irritating than the new "civilized" clean "intellectually minded" culture that by the way still costs a fucking fortune to even be a part of, it's fake and disingenuous to me.


Thy Shrine wrote:
Oh yeah it's frustrating hearing total normies talk about their generic fuckin taste as if it's high intellectual art, reminds me of high school.


Yeah, this. I know we may not agree on what specifically fits into these categories, but I agree with the general sentiment.

I try as hard as possible not to gatekeep, but I am growing very tired very quickly by people who have preformated opinions and the most bland, generic and flavorless takes on anything culture/art related.

If it wasn't so damn common, I wouldn't mind, but a bunch of people are just binging on whatever entertainment there is available to them and then they pretend to know about art. It makes my eyes roll so hard, it actually makes me dizzy.

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:59 pm 
 

Well my issue wasn't really with people enjoying whatever mainstream shit. Just with the the trends toward this infantilization of entertainment. Not healthy I think.
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Thy Shrine
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Location: Golgotha
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 8:11 pm 
 

There is a certain weird trend in entertainment today that seems to just have to be about all these cute kids doing funny kid stuff and oh it's so cute, no it's fucking sickening and doesn't make me think very highly of people that have exceptionally kid taste, I either think they just never grew up or theres some dark skeletons in their closet

I think it's all very odd, and believe there's definitely a pedophilic undercurrent to modern society
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HeavenDuff
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:35 pm
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Location: Montréal
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2023 11:38 pm 
 

Thy Shrine wrote:
I think it's all very odd, and believe there's definitely a pedophilic undercurrent to modern society


I'm gonna go ahead and say you might just be jumping a little quickly to conclusions here. Just a tad.

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Thy Shrine
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:37 pm
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Location: Golgotha
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2023 12:45 am 
 

Maybe, I should phrase that a little better, I think children are definitely exploited in media to the extent that someone could make the argument women are, I don't particularly think a responsible parent should be so willy nilly about putting their oh so cute child out there, but you're right, that's me making my leap and it doesn't exactly connect to what you or Empyreal were talking about but my mind kinda moves a mile a minute with these sort of things, and I think it's by and large a valid criticism
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DoomMetalAlchemist
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Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2010 6:10 am
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2023 6:30 pm 
 

So Tom Araya is from Chile. How and when did he get to the U.S.?

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DeadKid
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:51 am
Posts: 544
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2023 8:30 pm 
 

DoomMetalAlchemist wrote:
So Tom Araya is from Chile. How and when did he get to the U.S.?


https://www.last.fm/music/Tom+Araya/+wiki
Quote:
Araya was born in Valparaíso, Chile as the fourth child in a family of nine. At the age of five, his family moved to South Gate, California. Rumors circulating the internet state he left because of "political unrest", Araya denied this claim; "that happened in ‘71 and we were already in the United States by that time."

I guess it was more just a case of his family seeking opportunity.
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DoomMetalAlchemist
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 11:02 am 
 

DeadKid wrote:
DoomMetalAlchemist wrote:
So Tom Araya is from Chile. How and when did he get to the U.S.?


https://www.last.fm/music/Tom+Araya/+wiki
Quote:
Araya was born in Valparaíso, Chile as the fourth child in a family of nine. At the age of five, his family moved to South Gate, California. Rumors circulating the internet state he left because of "political unrest", Araya denied this claim; "that happened in ‘71 and we were already in the United States by that time."

I guess it was more just a case of his family seeking opportunity.


:metal:

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yungstirjoey666
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:47 am
Posts: 643
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 1:23 pm 
 

Can Princes of the Universe by Queen be considered power metal in your guys' opinion? Why or why not? I mean, Stone Cold Crazy is often considered a thrash song, so it's not like it's too far-fetched.

Spoiler: show

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Opus
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 11:06 am
Posts: 4289
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 3:46 pm 
 

yungstirjoey666 wrote:
Can Princes of the Universe by Queen be considered power metal

No. Why would it?
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yungstirjoey666
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 3:58 pm 
 

Same reason for why Stargazer by Rainbow or Manowar are considered heavy/power metal; stuff like choirs and keyboard effects. I think I even hear some double kicks in the chorus, but I am not too sure. I should've specified that I was more referring to USPM in relation to the Queen song. Maybe I am just salty because Queen fans insist that they played every genre at one point, yet power metal is not listed among them.

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DanielG06
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2020 8:11 pm
Posts: 535
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 5:51 pm 
 

yungstirjoey666 wrote:
Same reason for why Stargazer by Rainbow or Manowar are considered heavy/power metal; stuff like choirs and keyboard effects. I think I even hear some double kicks in the chorus, but I am not too sure. I should've specified that I was more referring to USPM in relation to the Queen song. Maybe I am just salty because Queen fans insist that they played every genre at one point, yet power metal is not listed among them.


The part about Queen fans is true, every time I hear that Queen invented thrash metal a part of me dies inside. If Stone Cold Crazy is thrash metal, then Helter Skelter by The Beatles is doom metal. The best part is when they put down bands that they've never even listened to because "Queen did it first".
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CreepingDeath16
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2021 12:49 am
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 5:58 pm 
 

DanielG06 wrote:
If Stone Cold Crazy is thrash metal, then Helter Skelter by The Beatles is doom metal.

You're thinking of I Want You (She's So Heavy). Helter Skelter is obviously the first blackened speed metal song.
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yungstirjoey666
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 6:13 pm 
 

It's also like saying The Who created death metal via Boris the Spider (though tbh, the growl effects in that song sound creepier than most death metal growls I've heard).

Overall I think the Princes of the Universe to power metal comparison makes more sense than any of these, because it wasn't just some early anomally with some subtle elements of an extreme genre, but it was released in 1986, and would actually fit in with the music scene at the time. But I guess it's not as impressive to fans because a) Queen did not do it first, and b) power metal isn't as edgy to them as the darker genres.

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Opus
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2002 11:06 am
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Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 8:13 pm 
 

yungstirjoey666 wrote:
But I guess it's not as impressive to fans because a) Queen did not do it first, and b) power metal isn't as edgy to them as the darker genres.

and c) it's a prog rock song.
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yungstirjoey666
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:47 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 9:29 pm 
 

And Stone Cold Crazy and Helter Skelter are just trad heavy and noise rock songs respectively, but that didn't stop them from labeling as such, did it?

Also what makes you say it's prog rock?

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Kalaratri
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Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:22 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2023 5:54 pm 
 

I never believed in the whole idea of the Beatles inventing metal or Queen inventing thrash. They may have written songs that contained elements that would later be used in those genres but you need the whole package to be considered a part of them. Besides which in the case of the Beatles there are a lot of proto-metal bands like Steppenwolf, Iron Butterfly, Blue Cheer etc. who would have a better claim than them, although I wouldn't say any of them invented heavy metal either.

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Xymosys
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:19 am
Posts: 1268
Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:35 am 
 

Does anybody know is Bruce Dickinson's Scream For Me Brazil live album actual full captured live performance or shortened one? I'm asking cos' it sounds edited and cut of in some sections. And somehow, the length of the album is way to short for, presumably, influential headliner like Mr. Dickinson himself.
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Svarthavid
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2006 6:44 am
Posts: 129
Location: Norway
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 8:40 am 
 

Haven't read through all the new posts (will now and come back with something more constructive if there's a discussion that someone hasn't replied to yet), but is it only me that instantly thinks of Candlemass when they hear the 1964 Goldfinger theme? Lyrically, vocally and last but not least musically it feels surprisingly ahead of its time, especially the latter. Both rule BTW, the theme and the band!
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mirons
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 12:59 pm
Posts: 665
Location: Latvia
PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2023 4:01 am 
 

I've been thinking about why there isn't a German death metal scene? We all talk about scenes from Florida, NY, Stockholm, Gothenburg, Netherlands, Finland... There are/were some great German DM bands in the early 90's, with Atrocity, Morgoth and Fleshcrawl being probably the most well known, and quite a few that remained low profile (Obscenity, Torchure, Jumpin' Jesus, Mangled Torsos, etc.; also let's not forget the death/thrash monster of an album A Shedding of Skin by Protector). However, it seems death metal didn't really take off in Germany the way it did in some other places.

Was it the lack of a homogenous and/or unique style? I'm not sure about that, seeing as the neighboring Dutch scene was quite diverse - Pestilence, Asphyx, Sinister, Gorefest don't sound all that similar to my ears either. Or perhaps there was no geographically compact accumulation of like-minded bands?

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yungstirjoey666
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2023 3:38 pm 
 

Is it just confirmation bias, or is there something going on in Florida that makes their power metal so good?

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 35268
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2023 3:41 pm 
 

yungstirjoey666 wrote:
Is it just confirmation bias, or is there something going on in Florida that makes their power metal so good?


It's an insane place where lots of people want to go to, weather-wise or for whatever other reasons. So some of them will naturally be creatives.
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yungstirjoey666
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Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:47 am
Posts: 643
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2023 3:52 pm 
 

Funny enough, Ohio seems to have a bigger concentration of power metal bands (156 vs 119, and roughly half population difference). However, their power metal/adjacents doesn't seem to be as well-recognized as Florida's (so far I only recognize Chastain, though there are possibly more others that I may be missing). Meanwhile, Florida has more higher tier bands like Iced Earth, Kamelot, Savatage, Agent Steel, and Crimson Glory, as well as close adjacent acts such as Trivium and TSO.

Of course, it's just a coincidence that both states are subjects to memes.

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Kaleva
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2021 12:41 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Stranger in a Strange Land
PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:35 pm 
 

Does anyone know what David DeFeis does for living? I know it's gossip, but I I'm really curious. I just read he's considering which gig offers to accept this summer, and taking into account that they almost don't play live, that their records can't sell well (I don't think they had a massive record success, not even at their prime), and that I can't find any information about other bands he has produced in his studio (although, given the sound of his latest albums, no one in their right mind should let DeFeis be their producer), I'm surprised that he would consider offers instead of grabbing every opportunity while he can.

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wone21r
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2020 12:26 am
Posts: 171
PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2023 7:16 pm 
 

Kaleva wrote:
Does anyone know what David DeFeis does for living? I know it's gossip, but I I'm really curious. I just read he's considering which gig offers to accept this summer, and taking into account that they almost don't play live, that their records can't sell well (I don't think they had a massive record success, not even at their prime), and that I can't find any information about other bands he has produced in his studio (although, given the sound of his latest albums, no one in their right mind should let DeFeis be their producer), I'm surprised that he would consider offers instead of grabbing every opportunity while he can.


I don't know the person or band you're referring to, but that sounds like a perfect example of exactly when a band SHOULD be selective with regards to shows/touring options.
If a band isn't a full time job, then managing time off the "real job" is important. And if they aren't big enough to guarantee that every show is a financial success, then they need to make sure the shows they play all have favourable terms, guarantees etc.

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Thexhumed
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:26 pm
Posts: 1922
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2023 4:16 pm 
 

What's the name of this particular type of riff+rhythm combination which sounds like an "epic march"?

Check the opening riffs of these 2 songs and you'll know what I'm talking about



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Opus
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2023 10:42 pm 
 

Thexhumed wrote:
What's the name of this particular type of riff+rhythm combination which sounds like an "epic march"?

Since when does riffs have names?
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BastardHead
Worse than Stalin

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Location: Oswego, Illinois
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2023 1:43 am 
 

Opus wrote:
Thexhumed wrote:
What's the name of this particular type of riff+rhythm combination which sounds like an "epic march"?

Since when does riffs have names?


Riffs are named after techniques and contexts all the time (I can call something a tremolo riff, gallop, thrash break, etc and most people here would know what they sound like).

The examples in the post don't really have a name in my head though. Not everything needs to be neatly categorized.
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Thexhumed
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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 2:26 pm
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Location: Chile
PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2023 10:41 am 
 

I'm not well versed in musical terminology but I was hoping someone who is could tell me a bit about it
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yungstirjoey666
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2023 11:19 pm 
 

Do you guys know of any metal album covers with spring foliage (eg. blooming trees and flowers)?

Thexhumed wrote:
What's the name of this particular type of riff+rhythm combination which sounds like an "epic march"?


I dunno the name of this riff, but are these also what you're looking for?

Spoiler: show



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Korpgud
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2013 7:09 pm
Posts: 290
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2023 5:06 am 
 

yungstirjoey666 wrote:
Do you guys know of any metal album covers with spring foliage (eg. blooming trees and flowers)?


Spoiler: show


+ probably any number of Art Nouveau type album covers. No specific album comes to mind at the moment, but I seem to recall it was all the rage a few years ago.
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yungstirjoey666
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:47 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:11 am 
 

Art Nouveau seems interesting. I should try checking out more artwork.

Which also reminds me, how come Greek mythology themes aren't as relatively prevalent as Germanic/Norse in metal? I know modern-day Greece is more Christian than Scandinavia, but there is a lot of Greco-Roman romanticism in the western world. The ideas of Hades ruling the Underworld with Cerebus or the entire Illiad epic are pretty metal imo.

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DoomMetalAlchemist
Veteran

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2010 6:10 am
Posts: 2865
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 6:08 am 
 

God I hope someone can solve this for me.

Why do people always pronounce Vinny Appice's last name as "AP (as in apple)-puh-see," while on the other hand, everyone always pronounces Carmine Appice (most famous for being the drummer for Vanilla Fudge) as "uh-PIECE"? They're fucking brothers, their last names should be literally the exact same thing as each other.

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mynameishere
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2022 1:36 am
Posts: 73
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 6:21 am 
 

.


Last edited by mynameishere on Sun Mar 12, 2023 6:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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colin040
Metal freak

Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:00 pm
Posts: 7635
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 6:37 am 
 

Kaleva wrote:
Does anyone know what David DeFeis does for living? I know it's gossip, but I I'm really curious. I just read he's considering which gig offers to accept this summer, and taking into account that they almost don't play live, that their records can't sell well (I don't think they had a massive record success, not even at their prime), and that I can't find any information about other bands he has produced in his studio (although, given the sound of his latest albums, no one in their right mind should let DeFeis be their producer), I'm surprised that he would consider offers instead of grabbing every opportunity while he can.


Some years ago, I read an interview in which he said that he hasn't worked for years.

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Raven_Augustus
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2022 8:30 pm
Posts: 316
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2023 4:29 pm 
 

So I'm checking out Sodom these days, and I saw there are 2 version of their debut album Obsessed by Cruelty (both released, one by Metal Blade and the other by Steamhammer). Are there any meaningful difference, and is there a definite version?

I know I should probably just listen to both and make up my own mind, but this thread exists so... :p

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King_of_Arnor
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 12:35 pm
Posts: 793
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2023 5:51 pm 
 

Raven_Augustus wrote:
So I'm checking out Sodom these days, and I saw there are 2 version of their debut album Obsessed by Cruelty (both released, one by Metal Blade and the other by Steamhammer). Are there any meaningful difference, and is there a definite version?

I know I should probably just listen to both and make up my own mind, but this thread exists so... :p

The short answer is yes, there's major differences between them as they are separate recordings. The American version was never supposed to be released, but which one is better just depends on which you prefer. The biggest differences are the drums being louder on the American version and the guitar tuning being lower on the European version.

The long answer (from the additional notes here):
Quote:
Obsessed by Cruelty was actually recorded twice, and both versions of the album were released in different territories due to an error by the record company. The first session was recorded in Berlin, supposedly by Horst Müller, with Destructor as the guitarist. The record company deemed the recording quality to be too poor for the album to be released, so all the tracks, as well as a new one called "After the Deluge", were recorded again at Studio Hilpoltstein (near Nuremberg) by Bobby Bachinger, with a new guitarist called Ahäthoor (aka Assator).

The original, rejected, recording from Berlin was accidentally used on the original US edition, released by Metal Blade, and most editions of the album on all formats. Only the European Steamhammer edition of the LP seems to contain the second recording from Studio Hilpoltstein with the additional "After the Deluge" track: beside the Lp on Steamhammer, the Studio Hilpoltstein version can be found only on a Chilean bootleg CD by Kamikaze Products released in 2007.
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Spiner202
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 3:32 pm
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2023 7:24 am 
 

Does anyone know what's going on with Heathen and Lee Altus? I saw Heathen on Sunday night and he wasn't there, which I know is pretty common when he's busy with Exodus, but it looks like Exodus doesn't have any shows for over 2 months. Have they just concluded it's easier to permanently replace him in a live setting, but he'll keep writing songs for the band?

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