Right of the bat, I have to mention that I'm not a big fan of Dimmu Borgir. To be precise, I do enjoy some of their material, but find their body of work, from a broader perspective, to be kind of underwhelming, but not without potential or glimpses of brilliance. They have an uneven discography, but they had good ideas, good moments, but lacked consistency, IMHO, so I can't really consider them to be a band I really enjoy much.

The reason why I wanted to discuss their 1997 to 2003 stretch specifically, is because I tend to think of it as the period where they might have been the most interesting, somewhat original and more consistent. I excluded Stormblåst on purpose, as I never really got the hype surrounding it, and IMHO, it didn't really hold a candle to the other albums released at the time in the "symphonic black metal" trend. It's not a terrible album, per se, but comparing it to In The Nightside Eclipse or Anthems to the Welkin at Dusk, I don't really think of it as a great album. For all tid, I excluded because it's as generic as symphonic black metal can get.

The stretch Enthrone Darkness Triumphant - Spiritual Black Dimensions - Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia - Death Cult Armageddon, while it is not exactly fantastic, shows a bit more potential, something much more interesting, and even has glimpses of greatness. Enthrone Darkness Triumphant, more specifically, is probably their best album overall in my opinion, and it gives me vibes of Emperor mixed with Arcturus, but with the distinctiveness of Dimmu. While they kind of attempted to do that style of symphonic avant-gard(ish) black metal later in their discography, they always fell short and ended up sounding like a weaker Arcturus. And yeah, Dimmu Borgir is a band I can't help but to constently compare with Arcturus for many reasons. For starters, because Hellhammer and ICS Vortex were in both bands at some point, and also because, well, they sound similar in many ways. But Arcturus is, IMHO, the far better band here. They mastered the whole avant-garde black metal style very early on. I was revisiting La Masquerade Infernale the other day, and I was still amazed by the fact that this masterpiece came out as early as 1997. Anyway, back to Dimmu Borgir, I think that Enthrone Darkness Triumphant is their best, and while SBD and PEM are not as solid, they kind of further explore that sound, maybe with diminishing returns, but with still enough quality for these albums to be worth revisiting from time to time.

I included Death Cult Armageddon in this, not so much because it's amazing or anything, but because there is something very unique, experiemental (in a way) and out there, especially for the time. Having DB play write and record an entire album with an orchestra, made for a completely different "black metal" experience. I don't want to debate whether it's actual black metal or not. I really don't care much about that discussion in the context of this thread, but I want to include it in the discussion because I feel it to have been born out of an authentic attempt to make something different and unique. Is it commercial and sellout? Well, maybe, but I still find it interesting.

From Stormblåst MMV (in 2005) and onward, I feel like they started to lose speed significantly. They retained their distinctive Dimmu Borgir sound, but they never really came up with anything that did a lasting impression, at least for me. Hence the fact that I excluded them from my post.

So yeah, after this long OP, I would like to know what others think of the 1997-2003 run of Dimmu Borgir, if I'm right or wrong about these albums, if I'm right or wrong to include or exclude one or many albums from their "good stretch" or if my idea of a good stretch is wrong altogether. Basically, I want to know what others think about these albums and their quality.

I always think they chased the $$$$$ from the start to such a extent they became the archetypal sellout band, referred to by more than one fellow norse BM artist as "Nu-bm".

I remember getting promo's of their albums up to 'P.E.M.' from a journalist friend, and i just never saw the appeal in any of it. Totally MOR, horrendously overproduced, 'safe', bland parping crap, even the artwork looked like it had been generated by the Nuclear blast artwork generating computer, that manages to produce some of the worst artwork on earth.

While I can understand why some don't like Dimmu Borgir, for me personally, everything from the debut to Death Cult Armageddon is where their best releases are. In terms of 1997-2003 specifically, Enthrone Darkness Triumphant and Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia remain my favorites from this time period, though I will admit that Spiritual Black Dimensions doesn't exactly click with me like all of their other albums.

I'm revisiting SBD right now, and it has some very good moments, and some solid ICS Vortex clean vocals. At their best they still don't impress me quite as much as bands like Emperor or Arcturus, but SBD and EDT have some solid moments that reminds me of a more symphonic, less avant-garde Arcturus in a very positive way.

Puritanical was one of my first two black metal albums, along with Emperor's Prometheus. Kind of an odd introduction to the genre (I think it was a while before I got around to classic Emperor, Darkthrone, etc.). I kept Prometheus in my collection, would maybe give it a C or C+ overall, with a good deal of nostalgia-type bias factoring in. Puritanical, however, I did not keep, and have never really been inspired to revisit, though I remember at least the first couple tracks having some high-quality moments. (Ditto Deathcult.)

Enthrone was an important album to me in my exploratory period, and has some tracks (e.g. "In Death's Embrace") I wouldn't hesitate to recommend to someone new to the genre, though they're a bit shy of "classic" status IMO. I still enjoy most of the album - along with Spiritual to a lesser extent, despite some cartoonish moments. Maybe it's just me, but I think Astennu is a somewhat underrated guitarist, and wish he would've made more music. (See also Covenant's Nexus Polaris.)

I think the Stormblast re-recording is surprisingly good. I seem to remember the original sounding kind of flat, and for years I figured it was an iron-clad law that re-recordings always suck, so, I didn't bother to check it out until a few years ago. It exceeded my expectations, and I still listen to it about as frequently as Enthrone.

Never checked out anything else by them.

I think I'm the only person ever who thinks For All Tid is their best album. I love the atmosphere on that one so much.

As a fan of their 3 first albums I also think For All Tid was their best. Spiritual was OK.

Huge band for me when I first discovered extreme metal in the mid-2000s, which should come as no surprise given how popular they were at the time. That said, my tastes have wandered and I never find myself revisiting pretty much any of their stuff nowadays. I'd still consider Enthrone Darkness Triumphant a great album though, which was certainly my favourite when I was a dedicated fan.

Seriously, I find it easy to forget now just how big Dimmu was circa 2004/2005. What a goddamn nosedive they took in terms of productivity/exposure over the past, I dunno, fifteen years? I can't even speak to the quality of their more recent music because I think In Sorti Diaboli was the last I listened to.

I do like this run of theirs quite a bit. PEM being my favorite(dem drums). While I like PEM the most I'd say DCA is the culmination of their style and their best sounding album. Lost all interest after DCA, bought SB MMV but didn't care for it and anything else I heard beyond that.

Old Man's Child was always preferable to Dimmu, and I wish Galder put more effort there.

I'd really like to hear Peter Tagtgren's original mix of Spiritual Black Dimensions though. He said in an interview he found the original mix and gave it to Tjodalv. Told him that this was what the album was supposed to sound like. Figured it may come to light now that they've done that remix of PEM.

I don't think it's terrible, just very generic, and it doesn't standout at all compared to other albums released in 1995 and prior.

Enthrone Darkness Triumphant, while not flawless by any means, shows more personnality and is more adventurous, in my opinion.

A best decent - 'Mourning Palace' is certainly a very good (not great) song, with many cool parts - and the whole of EDT is very listenable. The others didn't resonate with me much: even more hollow, showy and flashy... entering the drum wars without much great writing backing it up. I love Nick Barker as a drummer - but his work in Cradle is just so much more impactful (songs that really matter being the key factor, I suppose).

Stormblast is a cool album, I will give them that. That and Enthrone Darkness Triumphant are worth seeking out once you've explored the top 100 black metal albums, hah.

Absolutely a "gateway" band for me into Black Metal. Got into them just before PEM was released - but haven't paid much attention since Deathcult Armageddon. I wouldn't say there is one full record that I love, but I could easily make a 14-15 track Greatest Personal Hits that is full of nostalgic power.

I met them once (when they were playing Ozzfest in 2004) and Vortex was a super cool dude. The rest of them seemed like they couldn't be bothered (especially Mustis, who barely even looked at any of us).

Morning Palace still gets me fired up and I absolutely love their cover of Burn In Hell.

For all Tid and Stormblast are the only two albums I listen to from them.

Enthrone Darkness Triumphant got them alot of exposure and while there's a few songs that are quite good, the album comes off as a bit goofy at times. Same could be said about Spiritual and Puritanical more or less.

I saw them live with Cryptopsy and Krisiun back in 2002 and remember it being really lackluster (besides Vortex).

I also remember that I couldn't make it through Death Cult Armageddon.

This is a perfect summation of my opinion on them, as well. The idea of Dimmu Borgir is/was better than the actual product.

Yeah, this. I often say that I would like to enjoy Dimmu Borgir more. Like, there are glimpses of great ideas here and there, so solid foundations, solid musicians involved, but it rarely leads to great material. However, I do think that they have genuinely great moments, even if their discography is lacking in many regards.

Not a bad band, but also not great.

It's been a while since I listened to it but I thought EDT was pretty cool. It had some of the mellowness of the previous albums but the songwriting was a more refined and was incorporating more of the bombasticness they would be known for
with their later albums, but not going fully overboard yet. The Godless Savage Garden EP was also nice even if it was mostly rerecordings and live tracks. Haven't checked out much past Spiritual.. but was underwhelmed by what I heard. I do have a three day weekend ahead so maybe I'll binge this era.

I completely dismissed this band circa 2006 because I was left cold by the Stormblast re-recording and hated Death Cult as I viewed that album as “metalcore with keyboards” and “not real black metal” at the time.

I’ve revisited this band’s discography last year and was surprised to see how much I enjoyed a lot of it, while recognizing that their mid to later music is not the “purest” form of black metal, or even really black metal at all (it’s more some type of blackened hybrid genres).

Puritanical is absolutely excellent, and Enthrone is a close second.

Spiritual, For All Tid, and the original Stormblast hold up as decent albums as well.

Still cold on Death Cult and was left somewhat cold by In Sorte (my first ever listen to this one). Not terrible, but not great.

Pleasantly surprised by Abrahadabra and Eonian on my first listen, not black metal at all, but these come across as almost something of a blackened Nightwish type sound, or like Nightwish with black metal vocals. Both were interesting listens.

I love Enthrone Darkness Triumphant. I think that's a great album. I quite like the original Stormblast too. I rarely stray from those two though - everything else I've heard doesn't really grab me.

I actually really liked Death Cult Armageddon back in the day. One of the very few orchestral albums that I think work as a whole. The orchestral elements are well done and fit the music, which is uncommon.

Great band, talented musicians, enjoyable, original albums, from start to finish. The only problem I have with their albums is the fact they are fast burning and after a couple of listening sessions to an album you pretty much can't listen to it any more, like junk food. I like how they say a big fuck you to all the naysayers and do what they do best for more than 25 years now without flinching.

Loved everything from Enthrone up to Deathcult, anything after that I don't care for.

Listen, I don't care what anyone says, Enthrone is a banger through and through. It was good then and still holds up well today, IMO.

I'll throw it on and enjoy it any day of the week. Puritanical also holds up well, but I don't think it's as good as Enthrone.

Death Cult is kinda where they started to fall off for me, honestly. There are still some good songs, but I don't really care for it all that much

I bet you didn't even listen to their latter stuff. Abrahadabra is great and Eonian is good too. It's like taking the best parts of the simphonic moments of let's say Septic Flesh's Ophidian Wheel and A Fallen Temple and pushing them forward into that grand, all-encompassing, dark, enigmatic opera of sorts where metal is not important any more as such, but that cosmic feeling of greatness and bewilderment, coming from wonderful, neo-classical/dark orchestral compositions that are nothing short of being greater than life...

Fuck black metal. All hail Dimmu Borgir.

It took me ages to actually listen to Dimmu Borgir due to the hatedom, but I find EDT and DCA to be particularly great albums. You can also put me in the camp of folks who prefer the Stormblast Re-recording over the original.

Used to play For All Tid and Stormblåst a lot in my younger days, also loved them intensely for the atmosphere. They're repetitive for sure, but both have this unique sound, almost bordering on gothic at times, which for me at least only got better the more I played them. EDT started their downward spiral towards the generic extreme metal format with a hard-on for orchestras and more conventional song structures. It's frustrating because they clearly know how to write great melodies, they just tend to wrap them up in this exhibitionist delivery that makes it feel cheap and forgettable. I wish they would've stayed atmospheric, had a hard time with the Stormblåst rerecording for the same reason.

Back in the day I used to consider Old Man's Child's Revelation 666 the "superior" EDT It does mostly the same thing but with less of the generic "horror musical" tone palette and more of its own characteristic sound, something I feel like Dimmu lacks from EDT onwards.

1994-2003 is dimmu for me, best era

I actually quite like that era of Dimmu Borgir, and (perhaps controversially) it's my favorite era of the band. The lack of trveness and/or kvltness doesn't really bother me since I've never cared much about that to begin with. "Enthrone Darkness Triumphant" is my favorite album by them, followed closely by "Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia". I also really like "Death Cult Armageddon" honestly - fun stuff and one of the first extreme metal albums I ever bought.

They're good at being catchy and cinematic... or they were. I haven't liked the last couple albums much.

They got too symphonic but I do enjoy EDT and DCA.

The run of Enthrone Darkness Triumphant, Spiritual Black Dimnensions and Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia is my favorite phase of theirs, especially SBD feels like the unreachable climax to me.

The soundscape of this album always abducts me to unknown regions. What an unforgiving sound this album creates that gives ample spotlight to Mustis' godlike keyboards (be they romantic piano melodies as in Dreamside Dominions, majestic strings in the intro of The Promised Future Aeons or bombastically dark and harsh organ keys as in Behind the Curtains of Night-Phantasmagoria). This album manages to keep up such a ferocious level of aggression and tempo throughout its entirety, the riffs are fast and brutal with scorching rhythms and Astennu's lead guitar is absolutely lethal. Shagrath never sounded this pissed off again (I like all the spoken passages and the vocal delivery is quite diverse) and Vortex shines completely (looking at you The Insight and the Catharsis).

What a beautifully brutal cosmic symphonic black metal album. Anyone who loves this album should check out Astennu's Carpe Tenebrum project, especially the album Mirrored Hate Painting which is like the evil companion to SBD.

Second Spiritual Black Dimensions, always loved that album. The clean vocals on it from Vortex really work well. EDT is a very close second.

I'ts funny that they released a (crappy) track called "Gateways" cause I always think of Dimmu Borgir as just that. The band was probably as important as early (or mid) era In Flames in creating new metalheads in the 00:s. The guy I credit for getting me into true metal after I fell in love with Slipknot and The Haunted showed me a bunch of stuff (Cock And Ball Torture chocked the shit out of me lmao) and made me a mix CD with different bands and genres. He was a death metal guy and was firm in his opinion that black metal was mostly for girls but included "Blessings Upon the Throne of Tyranny" on the cd anyway. That memory always makes me laugh, but I kind of see where he was getting at when comparing early Carcass to Dimmu Borgir or Cradle of Filth.

Anyway I always thought that Dimmu Borgir is a mixed bag. Most albums have a few bangers but I like comparing them to eating a big meal at McDonald's (did I hear Demon Burger) – you feel good while eating it but fat and crappy afterwards and end up hungry for something more substantial an hour later. This might shock people a little bit but I think that the album I revisited the most times is In Sorte Diaboli. It's pretty short for a Dimmu Borgir album and the opening track is a banger. When talking about the era that the thread is actually about I guess Death Cult Armageddon is my pick but it's probably just cause it's the one I listened to the most times.

EDT, PEM and DCA are probably my favorites along with Stormblåst, honestly. SBD is good but the janky mix hurts it honestly.

FAT (nice acronym) is cool but it also feels really sloppy (also interesting that the original release and the Nuclear Blast version have different mixes to an extent), ISD is also good but a definite step down, and anything after they fired Mustis and Vortex has been another step down. It just doesn't interest me anywhere as much.

Acronyms should be forbidden in the forum. Honestly, it makes understanding anything ten times harder.

Id you spend time trying to understand dimmu borgir you're a better man than I


Overall opinion about them they're basically so fucking ok that I might march to the streets over just the sheer level of yeah that's fucking alright

Spiritual Black Dimensions is their only one flawless album, the other albums are simply good.

If I had to rank 'em:
Stormblåst (both)/Enthrone Darkness Triumphant/Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia/Death Cult Armageddon
Spiritual Black Dimensions
For all tid
In Sorte Diaboli
Abrahadabra/Eonian

This isn't counting any of the EPs, though they're pretty much all on For all tid's level.

This era is probably the most productive of their career. Before this they sort of blended in with the crowd of the Norwegian 90s scene, and after that they seemed so slow down, especially when they lost around 50% of their lineup after In Sorte Diaboli.

This was the era when they released albums consistently, and then toured wherever and whenever they could. Were they selling out? Yes, but they were also carving a path for the whole genre. I know Enslaved, Emperor, Immortal, Gorgoroth and probably a few others did tours in Europe earlier than Dimmu, but I get the impression that they were the first to do it as extensively as they did.

Enthrone Darkness Triumphant is their best album. It still had Shagrath playing guitar and his style is a lot more "riffy" than what they would do later. It also has a very good keyboard sound. It's less overly symphonic and more gothic and mysterious. If people like this style of black metal, then I recommend Galder's original band Old Man's Child.

Spiritual Black Dimensions is the last one I really like, but I rarely listen to it nowadays. Vortex' vocals are iconic, but it feels like it's running on the momentum of EDT rather than its own creativity. Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia is very forgettable, but it has a nice title track that is very iconic, being more industrial black metal than symphonic. I don't like Death Cult Armageddon at all, Shagrath's voice is just a croak at this point and there is no passion in the music at all.


I agree that it has a great atmosphere, but that's the only thing it has going for itself. The songwriting is pretty bland, the performances sloppy, and the production very raw. But I admit that it does have a magical and haunting atmosphere that is absent in the other albums, so I get what you mean.

EDIT: I guess I'll rank em as well.

Enthrone Darkness Triumphant
Stormblåst
Stormblåst 2005
Spiritual Black Dimensions
For all tid
Eonian
In Sorte Diaboli
Abrahadabra
Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia
Death Cult Armageddon

15-20 years back, these guys felt like they were really on the cusp of a mainstream breakthrough. They had a relatively strong contingent of fans that weren't otherwise metal fans, and it really seemed a question of when and not if they would really break out. I'm not well versed in their history, but something happened between 2005 and 2010 that just seemed to kill their momentum.

I think the rather ugly split with ICS Vortex and Mustis is part of what halted their momentum. "In Sorte Diaboli" was still a popular album after all (it went to no. 1 in Norway). Another reason for this is probably the fact that they aren't nearly as prolific anymore. 8 years between "Abrahadabra" and "Eonian" and 5 years since the latter... quite long stretches of time there. They also don't tour as frequently anymore.

Also, you can feel the loss of ICS Vortex and Mustis on these last two albums. "Abrahadabra" is disjointed and "Eonian" is just kinda boring imo. I know they weren't always part of the band (and my favorite Dimmu album - "Enthrone Darkness Triumphant" - has neither of them) but they eventually became a core part of their sound. I'd argue the addition of ICS Vortex in particular helped get them where they are. The clean vocals in "Progenies of the Great Apocalypse" certainly drew me in and made me a fan. I remember thinking "he sounds like Marco from Nightwish!", lol.

Well it's a good thing you didn't bet real money because you would have lost it, I did listen to it and I don't like it.