This might be a strange question because nobody questions if Type O Negative is metal and personally I'd like to think it's all metal, however a lot of their material is borderline Alternative Metal and I wonder if their discography was more limited if it would even let into the archives. Those first two albums are unambiguously metal, Bloody Kisses less unambiguous (although Black No. 1 definitely is), and despite being my favorite album from them, I'm not so sure if October Rust would be considered unambiguously metal going by the sites guidelines.


I'm not sure, what do y'all think? Not advocating for anything, of course, I just think this would be an interesting question to ask.

I personally think it'll still be accepted regardless, given that the metal parts are still pretty prominent. Then again, it's been a while since I've heard October Rust in its entirety, so perhaps I should check it out again sometime today.

Think of the first four actual tracks on the album (excluding the joke tracks at the start), imo this album has more in common with 90s Alternative Metal than Sabbath. It has a lot less doom, thrash, and traditional heavy metal influence compared to the other albums in their discography.

It depends. Are any of the mods big Type O Negative fans?

It’s a hybrid album. A bit of metal, lots of goth and ambient stuff, shoegaze makes an appearance, some synthpop/new wave. But compared with say Slow Deep and Hard, the metal influence is way way less.

In fact Pete said that it wasn’t a heavy “metal” album, whilst still being “heavy music”. Tend to agree. It’s dense in its heaviness, but not a lot of “metal”, barring some movements here and there.

I would say yes to it but we work towards overall consensus, so we'll only know the answer to your hypothetical for sure if multiple moderators are willing to participate in the discussion.


Whatever it depends on it definitely is not that.

gottem

While it's clearly Type O at their gothiest and also contains some very noticeable shoegazing, it's still a metal album to me. It still has those doomy moments.

I would say October Rust is a metal album... but it's borderline. It is undeniably influenced by the same sort of metal Bloody Kisses is, but it leans a lot harder on the more atmospheric and textural side of their sound - more goth rock as well as shoegaze and ethereal wave even. It is absolutely an album with a hybridised, diversified sound, more so than the preceding album. Pete himself saying it's not really heavy metal but more heavy music makes sense honestly.

If TON had only ever put that album out and they were on the archives, I imagine there'd be some debate over if they should. Similarly if they weren't, I imagine that debate would also be happening. I can totally see either side of that debate and why it even is up for debate. Again, whilst its rooted in metal, it is a bit of an edge case as far as its metalness goes; it's not even a particularly heavy album.

As an aside, it always amuses me when bands have heavily contrasting, almost diametrically opposed albums one after the other, and following this album up with World Coming Down is a pretty clear example of that.

Yeah. That definitely didn't happen with Faith No More.

Don't poke the bear.

Anyways, one of the things that made me ask the topic question is the fact that Pist.On isn't the archives despite the fact their first album definitely sounds like Type O.

I only heard it last year and no I doubt it'd be accepted just based on that album alone. It's basically light atmospheric pop extended to huge long gothy soundscapes. Really good album though. Excellent mood setting.

as a side note, either way, metal or otherwise, I've never understood what all the fuss is with this band's music.

It's probably their most accessible album overall due to the strong pop influences, and tends to lean into the gothic atmosphere more so than any other album they've released, but I'd say its a metal album as the riffs still have a fuzzy, doomy quality to them even if they aren't quite as abrasive as they would be on albums like Slow, Deep, and Hard or World Coming Down.

It’s about as metal as something like A Deeper Kind of Slumber or Irreligious, which is to say kinda sorta probably not.

My dude asking the real questions

Not sure really. There are plenty of riffs, but they are quite understated on the album. I can see someone who's a fan of gothic/alternative stuff getting into this, but I can also see someone who likes old Sabbath getting into it too. I'll be the enlightened centrist and say it's 50-50 chance if they would be on the archives or not.

Great album nonetheless! It gets some heat for the mainstream approach, and using Peter's sexiness to appeal to female listeners, but it definitely all works on this album.

It is indeed a great album. It's actually my favorite Type O Negative album, even if it's their least "metal". They're just really good at that atmospheric gothic approach, I guess... and it's hard to think of anything else with quite the same vibe. I feel that way about all of their albums though (and I love them all)... one of the best bands to ever walk this fucking earth.

Honestly, they’re their own genre. No one sounds like them. Very very unique.

They're very hit and miss. Bloody Kisses and October Rust are their two best imo, but both of them are riddled with mediocre filler in between amazing tracks.

The thing is when said tracks hit they hit hard as fuck. Christian Woman, Love You to Death and Die With Me would validate their existence even if they were the only things they ever put out.

Also it's more of a novelty than anything but their metal covers of old rock songs are very fun

If you said that about every band that nobody sounds like you'd have a million genres, I think you have to accept that every genre has a wide umbrella with regards to sound. Personally, I don't think anything sounds like Candlemass but I wouldn't label them as "Ripping Candlemasscore Doom Metal" or some shit.

Cos they're a pioneering and unique band that bridged musical gaps all whilst having a ton of personality and knowing their way around a great song.

Also, World Coming Down is their best.

Pioneering how exactly?

I completely agreed with you all throughout their existence, until within the last year I heard October Rust. I had heard songs of theirs on the radio, but never October Rust.

I love this album. Even with this fucking weirdo talking about "doing anything to make you cum" sounding like Dracula with haunting music going on in the background I still love this album. I finally understand why people care so much about Type O Negative.

Its like asking would ACDC be considered a metal band if they had only released Flick of The Switch. Both are damn good album if you ask me.

By Metal Archives definitions, we can confirm the answer to that is no otherwise AC/DC would have a bandpage. The original hypothetical is not as clear. A band only needs to have one predominantly metal album to be accepted on the site.

Many rock bands were taking a stab at metal in the early 80s. AC/DC were no different, except for the fact that they nailed it, and produced one of the heaviest albums of '83 (which says a lot being that it was a banner year for thrash & metal overall). Hard to believe AC/DC could compose such heavy music. Wish they did more albums like this one.

They're not pioneering. Popular band, one of my favorites. They haven't started a whole scene, movement, or sound though compared to Death or Venom or Bathory.

exactly my thoughts.

While they didn't pioneer a scene, they did have a very distinct take on gothic doom metal that's apparently hard to replicate since I don't hear many other bands quite like them. I suppose "Mandylion"/"Nighttime Birds"-era Gathering comes closer than others due to a similar pool of influences, but even then... definitely a different vibe.

If I want my Gothic fix, I'd rather listen to The Sisters Of Mercy; they are 100 times better in that regard than anything Type O Negative could offer to me.

The Sisters of Mercy and Type O Negative are hardly comparable.

The only type o song that kind of sounds like the Sisters was My Girlfriends Girlfriend. That’s it. Not comparable at all beyond that. Type O were much closer to Sabbath than SOM.

lol

Glad I wasn't the only one that noticed that.

I don't understand how anyone can compare Type O Negative with Black Sabbath.

You don't? Listen to Pyretta Blaze and then listen to Into the Void

Yeah, Type O Negative has a really strong Black Sabbath influence. That's a good example.

The Black Sabbath influence is incredibly obvious, whether we're talking about "Pyretta Blaze" or their doomified cover of "Summer Breeze" (which is what got me into the band - thanks "I Know What You Did Last Summer"!). I... don't see how the comparison is hard to understand.