Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives :: View topic - CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread

Well there are no scans of the disc on Discogs so I can't compare directly. I don't think mine's a bootleg though. It has enough wear on it that it looks authentic, and there are no glaring typos or anything clearly suggesting bootleg. Plus I don't know why anyone would bootleg this considering you can get the original for like $10 no problem. Guess I'll have to wait and see what chaossphere says!

Buy a magnifying glass u philistine :lol:

Distributed by RED = USA

http://www.discogs.com/Jorn-Bring-Heavy-Rock-To-The-Land/release/4468505

That doesn't have any of those codes either. Not every factory uses them, especially smaller ones using older machines.

Italy is a very bootleggy country unfortunately, they definitely have some unscrupulous pressing plants.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Feb 01, 2015 5:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
You said the disc is gold, can you flip that disc over and get a nice close up photo of the matrix?

Author:	SleepingStar [ Sun Feb 01, 2015 6:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I didn't bother taking a photo of the CD as unfortunately there's no matrix, the only markings are BR-0059.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Feb 01, 2015 6:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
ha ha awesome, sounds dodgy as The gooks will often use X's and Z's in the matrix and SID codes, their SID codes are often too long too and they will have stuff 'scratched' out on the master, so it's then copied when they duplicate it, or maybe they have a team of monkeys scratching them out manually with a nail or something

Author:	chaossphere [ Mon Feb 02, 2015 4:22 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Nah it's child slave labour. Monkeys is good eatin'.

Author:	SacrifyX87 [ Fri Feb 06, 2015 9:38 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Hey guys. I need some help with a CD I plan to buy, Angel Dust - To Dust You Will Decay. I've really been researching this CD, I have the music videos in high quality (MPEG-2) and I'd like to buy the original 1st pressing CD, not only for my collection, but also to clean the music videos up too. I've really been looking at the bootlegs that sell for cheap on ebay ($10-$24), one thing I have really noticed is that the matrix numbers, and every single little detail on the original CD compared to the bootleg are identical, except one small thing: The original CD has this circle around the face of the CD itself, and it seems that the bootleg don't have this circle. Here's some pictures for proof, this is a picture of the original CD that I found on ebay selling for $299: And here's a scan of the original CD that I found online: Here's the cheap, bootleg copy that sells for about $18 on ebay: And here's another picture of the cheap bootleg copy, but a different CD/Picture: Besides the circle, which you can see near the outside of the CD, everything else is identical from what I can tell. Recently, I have noticed some auctions on ebay, people trying to sell the CD listed as the 'original', but the CD clearly don't have the circle around it. Either these people just don't realize what they have is a bootleg, or they are really trying to rip people off. But can anyone please verify this for me? Is the matrix number and everything 100% identical to the original CD on the bootleg, or so-called 're-issue' copy? Here's another (what seems to be) bootleg copy. Someone uploaded this on darkabyss.org, it's an actual scan of the bootleg CD: And here's the back scan too: I would really appreciate if someone could help figure this out here once and for all.

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Author:	SacrifyX87 [ Fri Feb 06, 2015 9:56 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Something else I noticed was the fact that the bootleg CD, on the logo that says 'Angel Dust' on top, it seems that the logo isn't '3D' looking, here's an example, This is the logo from the original CD: And here's the logo from the bootleg/'re-issue' CD: You can see the first logo has the more '3D' effect. Here's an auction on ebay with someone selling a real copy of the CD: http://www.ebay.com/itm/291364579795 It's quite expensive, but you can clearly see the ring around the CD, and the 3D looking logo too. Now here's another guy selling what is clearly listed as the 'original' CD for a big price, and he seems to be going out of his way to hide the fact that the CD is the bootleg copy: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271757520413 There's no ring around the CD, and you (probably purposely) can't see the logo so you can tell if it's 3D or not. Here's another guy selling a copy, clearly listed at the 'original', but he only gives you the matrix number, and you can't see if the CD has the 3D logo or the ring either: http://www.ebay.com/itm/151565034897

Author:	kyzanar [ Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
You seem to have identified the differences pretty well. As for the ebay auctions, it is pretty obvious to tell the difference between the bootleggers and the real ones, as the fakes will never have close up pictures of the disk/matrix (since the disk will be the main way you can differentiate usually, these days they are able to scan the artwork almost perfectly). Also they typically have almost no info in their description. The real sellers will always go out of their way to put things like 'Original', 'First Press', 'OOP', etc in the title, plus the year, and will stress in the description that their item is legitimate.

Author:	Asti78 [ Fri Feb 06, 2015 4:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
You can also see on the bootleg pictures that the matrix font is a typical one for bootlegs

Author:	metalmerchant023 [ Thu Feb 12, 2015 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Hi, I need help with identifying Satyricon-the shadowthrone cd. It has cat.# Fog008, barcode 4001617204122, matrix NORDISC A/S FOGCD 003. It has no IFPI, but I can't find it on discogs. Thanks.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
You might have to add it to the database, not everything is there, I just had a look too.

Author:	chaossphere [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Your Latest Album Purchase(s)
MonumentalBlackArt wrote: Haha, the matrix code on Discogs for that Amon Amarth disc is all wrong, someone put the German one in the USA entry. The matrix on mine and my original press of The Avenger are both quite faint, but that's just the pressing facility Metal Blade was using at the time. Oh yeah, I have the first press of The Somberlain it would seem.. although it doesn't look 100& identical to the one on Discogs. There's a mould SID code (but it's so tiny whoever did the Discogs entry could have overlooked it on their copy) and the CD face print doesn't go all the way to the edge of the silver centre part, but that's probably due to the factory using different machines.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:28 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Your Latest Album Purchase(s)
Re Amon Amarth CD - can you vote needs changes on that [minor/major you'll have to have a look]

Author:	MonumentalBlackArt [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:36 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Your Latest Album Purchase(s)
Are you sure? Mine matches the Discogs entry IIRC. I'll see if I can scan it tomorrow.

Author:	chaossphere [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:45 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Your Latest Album Purchase(s)
Right, so here's the matrix codes for my bought 'em back in the day Amon Amarth discs. They're both hard to read, especially Once Sent.. cause the matrix is all scuffed up from playing in radio station cartridge-loading CD players. OSFTGH: 29410AR 14133-2 982311-07 30D4-0420 Avenger: 32575AD-01BR 14262-2 99059-24 85DZ 1010 That said I can't remember exactly when I got Once Sent... but it can't have been more than 6 months after the initial release 'cause I ordered it as soon as I read the reviews. Yeah, that's how we rolled back then, 35 bucks based on what some dude in London who gets 500 promos a month had to say about it

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Thorns - Thorns Just a version query, as per usual Tocano vs dicentia vs DCM vs SDC vs god knows what Anyway that's not my question, what colour was the original disc? silver, white, black and white etc Discogs is incomplete http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Thorns/Thorns/3080 http://www.discogs.com/Thorns-Thorns/master/13409 http://www.musik-sammler.de/album/27039 This is what mine looks like, with the Metal Hammer / Orkus sticker on the front, silver disc https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9_IzPqCEAA8z7S.jpg

Author:	chaossphere [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:01 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Also, the one on Discogs says "Distributed by SPV GMBH". Mine are distributed by RED Distribution.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 10:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Buy a magnifying glass u philistine Distributed by RED = USA

Author:	dreadmeat [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
If you're trying to spot bootlegs sometimes the only way to tell is the font used in the matrix, the text itself is identical.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I'd vote needs changes then hijack the thing and see what everyone else says about it. The worst that will happen is you'll get an entirely incorrect vote. Have you looked in the history of the releases? often things like this will be talked about in there. There are clearly 2 different versions [at least]

Author:	chaossphere [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:27 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
MonumentalBlackArt wrote: Well there are no scans of the disc on Discogs so I can't compare directly. I don't think mine's a bootleg though. It has enough wear on it that it looks authentic, and there are no glaring typos or anything clearly suggesting bootleg. Plus I don't know why anyone would bootleg this considering you can get the original for like $10 no problem. Guess I'll have to wait and see what chaossphere says! Yeah I have no doubts about its authenticity.. it's just impossible to know if both versions were pressed at the same time, or if mine is a repress that just isn't listed. Matrix-wise both Once.. and Avenger are obviously made by the same facility. Thing is, I can't recall exactly when I got mine cause it was 16 years ago Mine has no IPFI codes at all. I'm just baffled by the fact that this pressing isn't listed on Discogs at all.

Author:	chaossphere [ Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
dreadmeat wrote: Buy a magnifying glass u philistine Distributed by RED = USA It's not so much the size of the font, it's the way it looks.. very faint and highly refractive, so the letters tend to distort and it can be hard to read depending on which angle you view them from. It probably wouldn't even show up on a scanner. There's no way mine are bootlegs either, got 'em in 98/99 from Tower Records, special-ordered from the US. Oh and the Once.. disc has "GER SPV: 084-102282" printed above the barcode. Possibly they made one batch in Germany and one in the US but printed them so they could be distributed in either territory.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 2:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I've been wanting to experiment with different light sources for a while, UV lights, black lights etc

Author:	ferencziffra [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 8:23 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Hello guys, I need help identifying a possible bootleg. I got this Megadeth - So Far, So Good... CD years ago: Spoiler: show I am sorry about the poor quality of the scan but basically what bothers me is that everything looks normal, it says IFPI 1504 too, although it's not visible in the picture. But the font of 2-4-3-NL - I've just never seen an EMI Uden stamp like this. Comparing it with this scan: Spoiler: show This one, I don't think has an IFPI code though.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:17 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
How curious... the bottom one is 'more typical'

Author:	chaossphere [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 4:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Probably just a result of both discs being made on different machines in the same factory. Either that or whoever bootlegged it was almost an evil genius and would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for those pesky kids.

Author:	Dio_For_Ever [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Can you help me with this cd? I think is fake because of there are not ifpi codes, nor muold nor mastering...

Author:	chaossphere [ Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
http://www.discogs.com/Jorn-Bring-Heavy ... se/4468505 That doesn't have any of those codes either. Not every factory uses them, especially smaller ones using older machines.

Author:	Dio_For_Ever [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 8:28 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
chaossphere wrote: http://www.discogs.com/Jorn-Bring-Heavy-Rock-To-The-Land/release/4468505 That doesn't have any of those codes either. Not every factory uses them, especially smaller ones using older machines. In my scans, is not reached to notice that the cd print quality is not very good. Please compare to this scans that i´ve found, see the detail in the back cover ("Made in Italy" is perfectly aligned with "digital audio", the word "JORN" has a different font type/logo):

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Italy is a very bootleggy country unfortunately, they definitely have some unscrupulous pressing plants.

Author:	chaossphere [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Hence why I figured it's probably just a poorly made disc. Italians don't like putting too much effort into anything that can't be eaten.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 3:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Or driven, or imbibed...

Author:	DeathfareDevil [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
On an unrelated note, I uploaded to discogs those scans for my weird reissue of Mortal Throne of Nazarene. Question about discogs: Is there not a way to view images for a release without going to the "edit images" section? I would've thought it would be more easily accessible from the main page of the release version. And once again the answer was right in front of me. Thanks. VVVVV

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Just click on the main image but not in the history/edit section.

Author:	Dio_For_Ever [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 9:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
dreadmeat wrote: Italy is a very bootleggy country unfortunately, they definitely have some unscrupulous pressing plants. It seems like the only one edition made by Frontiers is in digipack...

Author:	Dio_For_Ever [ Sun Feb 15, 2015 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
What about this? mastering ifpi is LB50, no mould ifpi