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Erosion of Humanity
Destroyer of the Gods

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:12 pm
Posts: 5799
Location: Chicago
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 10:39 pm 
 

Sweet, thanks for the clarification! I'll just keep going on business as usual then until otherwise instructed.
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HellBlazer
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 6:48 am
Posts: 2044
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 10:50 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
Not quite, it seems. When I add a CD version for a vinyl or tape parent, it still shows "Side A" on top. I have to edit the release and select "CD" again for that to disappear.


Um, do you mean versions that were added before I fixed it? Then yeah, they'll need to be re-saved, otherwise there shouldn't be a problem...?

Insidiae wrote:
Anyone with less than 1000 points:
»when trying to fill the new fields on the current version
»choosing vinyl/cassette
*automatically aggregate all tracks on Side A*
»needing to fill a report after to correct this

Should a special permission on this case should be added to the mere mortals?


Hmm, fair point. I've allowed non-veterans to drag the "side B" row if the format wasn't already set for that release.

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Insidiae
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 5:57 pm
Posts: 18
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 11:04 pm 
 

Thanks! Just now, I stumbled with the necessity of creating Side C and D, but I couldn't add a disc on-the-fly. Report also needed.

http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Ar ... ods/173401
http://www.discogs.com/Various-The-Hear ... ase/184325

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Derigin
The Mountain Man

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 6:25 am
Posts: 5679
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 11:09 pm 
 

Insidiae wrote:
Thanks! Just now, I stumbled with the necessity of creating Side C and D, but I couldn't add a disc on-the-fly. Report also needed.

http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Ar ... ods/173401
http://www.discogs.com/Various-The-Hear ... ase/184325

In order to fix that, you just need to take these steps:

1. Choose "Multiple" as the format.
2. At the bottom choose "Add a component". It'll pop up with a second vinyl record.
3. Move the Puissance and Penitent tracks over.
4. Ta Da! It even shows up as "2 vinyls" in the format. :)

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HellBlazer
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 6:48 am
Posts: 2044
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 11:18 pm 
 

MutantClannfear wrote:
EDIT 2: http://www.metal-archives.com/labels/A_ ... abs_albums Scroll down, the label's logo image overlaps the search tools.


Fixed.

Derigin wrote:
In order to fix that, you just need to take these steps:

1. Choose "Multiple" as the format.
2. At the bottom choose "Add a component". It'll pop up with a second vinyl record.
3. Move the Puissance and Penitent tracks over.
4. Ta Da! It even shows up as "2 vinyls" in the format. :)


He's not a veteran, so he can't do that when updating an existing album. Sorry Insidiae, it's impractical in this situation, but it's the long-standing rule that non-veterans can only add missing info, not modify what is already there. In the case of that album though, it sounds like it was entered incorrectly in the first place. It should have had the two discs already, and you would have then been able to set the sides correctly.

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HellBlazer
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 6:48 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2014 11:36 pm 
 

Sciera wrote:
I suppose if I don't know the release year it's better to not add a new version but to leave it to someone who has that infos?
Or should it be possible to also add versions without specifying the year?


Well, there's been some discussion about eventually allowing releases with unknown years, but that's not the case at the moment, so I'd say hold off on adding a version if you don't know its release year for now.

Quote:
And if I don't know which tracks belong onto which side of the tape/LP? Should I just leave all on the A side, or should such versions also be only added by someone who knows which track is on which side?


Hmm, it's probably better not to add that either. Hopefully someone who knows the proper track list will come along. The release should be mentioned in the parent's additional notes though so we have a record of it.

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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
Posts: 5157
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:44 am 
 

*link*
Has listed other versions in the version field, but no explanation on how it was actually released. Is this allowed or should such stuff be flagged?
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Last edited by Alhadis on Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
Jeepers creepers, OYDK, please shorten URLs next time...

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 10415
Location: Gradec, Austria
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:01 am 
 

HellBlazer wrote:
Azmodes wrote:
Not quite, it seems. When I add a CD version for a vinyl or tape parent, it still shows "Side A" on top. I have to edit the release and select "CD" again for that to disappear.


Um, do you mean versions that were added before I fixed it? Then yeah, they'll need to be re-saved, otherwise there shouldn't be a problem...?

Hmmm, could've sworn that happened with a fresh entry. But it's like you say, yeah. Nevermind.

HellBlazer wrote:
Azmodes wrote:
You can just add the additional tracks, if there are any? I don't see why we would need another field for stating the obvious.


I think he means just listing the number of tracks on the versions tab, not like have a specific field for it. This would make sense, though that table is getting really crowded already... we'll see.

Is that really needed, though? Dunno, it's just something that never came to mind before, personally, I don't see why we'd have to highlight that detail.

oneyoudontknow wrote:
*link*
Has listed other versions in the version field, but no explanation on how it was actually released. Is this allowed or should such stuff be flagged?

Wrong link? I don't see any other versions, nor are there any in the history.
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MetalCuresHeadaches
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2009 5:35 pm
Posts: 898
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:35 am 
 

HellBlazer wrote:
Quote:
And if I don't know which tracks belong onto which side of the tape/LP? Should I just leave all on the A side, or should such versions also be only added by someone who knows which track is on which side?


Hmm, it's probably better not to add that either. Hopefully someone who knows the proper track list will come along. The release should be mentioned in the parent's additional notes though so we have a record of it.


Hate to add more what-ifs, but what if the parent is the release with unknown sides? Bogs & Brimstone (both versions) are on cassette, but it's not listed online which side is which. (Likely should have combed over the thread here before updating them. My bad.)
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Azmodes
Ultranaut

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:38 am 
 

I'd be okay with leaving it like that until someone with the necessary info can correct it. Parent or child entry. I think having a proper entry as opposed to a mention in the notes is worth the slight ambiguity about the sides. YMMV and if HB disagrees, just ignore this post. :P
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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
Posts: 5157
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:59 am 
 

Azmodes wrote:
oneyoudontknow wrote:
*link*
Has listed other versions in the version field, but no explanation on how it was actually released. Is this allowed or should such stuff be flagged?

Wrong link? I don't see any other versions, nor are there any in the history.

Format: Other

no explanation what this other actually is
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Azmodes
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:07 am 
 

I see. Yeah, that should be explained in the notes/version description whenever possible. For entries from before the upgrade, the field can be left blank. I'll let the user know.
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~Guest 104167
Metalhead

Joined: Sun May 20, 2007 9:46 am
Posts: 551
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:18 am 
 

Hi! Please explain me how to add 2-in-1 re-issue as the other version without showing it up in the main discography. I've tried to add it for the Vice Human s/t full-length but in result I've got it listed as separate entry in the discography tab: http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Vice_Human/12080

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:30 am 
 

aeternus1990 wrote:
Hi! Please explain me how to add 2-in-1 re-issue as the other version without showing it up in the main discography. I've tried to add it for the Vice Human s/t full-length but in result I've got it listed as separate entry in the discography tab: http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Vice_Human/12080

You can't, really. It's alright to add an entry to each of the bundled parent releases (like you did). A separate listing should not be done. However, for regular users that happens automatically when the title varies from the parent and only mods can undo it. Please report these releases after you added them/when you come across them, so that a moderator can remove the listing and have it only show up in the other versions tab. The title variation is not really significant here, just a consequence of the bundle.
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MetalCuresHeadaches
Metalhead

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:39 am 
 

Can 'Boxed Set' be added to the formats? I'm sure there are other instances, but my comes from Underoath's "Lost in the Sound of Separation". It has a number of versions to start with (various regional CD releases on different labels, a special edition CD+DVD combo, Vinyl), but also has a 'collectors edition' combo set that includes a CD, a behind the scenes DVD, a pair of Vinyl records, and a hard cover book.

Other would cover that for now, but perhaps boxed set or something similar can be added.
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Azmodes
Ultranaut

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:39 am 
 

It should also be noted -pretty much as before the upgrade- that these bundled releases aren't always valid. Please exercise common sense in what should warrant a separate version. aeternus' case looks okay, since it's really two albums in new packaging on a single CD. But please don't go around and add hundreds of crappy oh-the-savings-bundles where there's two unchanged CDs in one plastic sleeve.

@MetalCuresHeadaches: Boxed sets can be selected as the release type, also for child entries of non-boxed set parents. EDIT: For child entries I would however recommend using the "multiple" format to detail these deluxe editions.
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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:06 pm 
 

Azmodes, you might want to notify this user as well:
http://www.metal-archives.com/users/aaa123

his edits:
Quote:
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Azmodes
Ultranaut

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:25 pm 
 

Thanks, message sent.
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HellBlazer
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 6:48 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:52 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
@MetalCuresHeadaches: Boxed sets can be selected as the release type, also for child entries of non-boxed set parents. EDIT: For child entries I would however recommend using the "multiple" format to detail these deluxe editions.


Yeah, you can use multiple formats for that kind of stuff. The "boxed set" type, though it has been misused a lot, is for releases that include many previously released albums collected into one package (and you would then specify the album titles rather than tracks), say for instance Priest's The Complete Albums, not for anything that comes in a box.

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:02 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
aloof wrote:
II. how about all the vinyl albums that get released in 100 red, 100 blue, and 300 black vinyl?

If they are all part of one, color-varying release, one entry is enough. Limitation would be 500, detail the numbers for each color in the version description.

An update on this, for (more complex) vinyl colours, it'd be best to keep the version description as concise as possible ("coloured vinyl", for example) and detail the limitation and varieties of each colour in the additional notes.
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MutantClannfear
Blank Czech

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:42 pm 
 

I want to add a reissue which was released both as black vinyl (with undisclosed limitation) and red vinyl (limited to 100). Do I leave the limitation field blank and explain that there are 100 red vinyl in the additional notes?

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Azmodes
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:51 pm 
 

Yes.
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MutantClannfear
Blank Czech

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:26 pm 
 

Got it. Also, what do we do about tape releases where the music repeats on both sides? Make a note of it in the additional notes?

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Azmodes
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:41 pm 
 

Duplicate the tracks for side B. The tracklist should be as close to the physical product as possible; see here, for example. But you can/should also make note of this in the notes. Can't hurt.
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MutantClannfear
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 9:36 pm 
 

Well, my main concern about doing that was that it would make the overall album length quite misleading. With that in mind - that it won't accurately convey the overall length of the album - is that still okay?

Also, another bug: http://www.metal-archives.com/labels/Pe ... abs_albums

Sort releases by year, ascending: there are five at the top of the list which aren't integrated for some reason.

EDIT: http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Me ... abs_lineup

The "Guest/session musicians" tab is showing up even though there's nothing there.

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Diamhea
Eats and Spits Corpses

Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:46 pm
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Location: At the Heat of Winter
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2014 11:18 pm 
 

Watch out for redundancy in the description field. I've come across a few people putting things like "2CD" and "Alternative artwork" in the description field, when the 2CD distinction already shows up under format. Uploading a new artwork should be obvious enough on it's own, so no need.
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HellBlazer
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 6:48 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:10 am 
 

MutantClannfear wrote:
Well, my main concern about doing that was that it would make the overall album length quite misleading. With that in mind - that it won't accurately convey the overall length of the album - is that still okay?


You know what, don't enter the songs on each side for now. I think I'll add a checkbox for double-sided formats to indicate they have the same songs on each side, and then they'll automatically be displayed correctly when viewing the album.

Quote:
Also, another bug: http://www.metal-archives.com/labels/Pe ... abs_albums

Sort releases by year, ascending: there are five at the top of the list which aren't integrated for some reason.

EDIT: http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Me ... abs_lineup

The "Guest/session musicians" tab is showing up even though there's nothing there.


Fixed.

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MutantClannfear
Blank Czech

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:37 am 
 

I think there should probably be some sort of way to "merge" two albums now. Here's an example of why: the Meshuggah album Nothing has a slightly different re-recorded version with a different mix and re-recorded guitars. I'd think that these two albums probably need to be linked together, now that the database can account for different release versions. However, the 2006 version has four reviews, so you can't just delete that entry and build a new one which links to the original album Nothing. There should be a way to associate two releases which existed before this feature was added to the database.

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Derigin
The Mountain Man

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 6:25 am
Posts: 5679
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:32 am 
 

The Nothing albums will stay separate.

Our policy on re-recordings is that if there's significant musical differences (as determined by the staff), such re-recordings may warrant their own entries. And, to be honest with you, if we combined them into one entry you'd likely have reissues for both albums that aren't at all musically similar to one another - the 2006 Nothing reissues would sound nothing alike to the 2002 Nothing album that they'd be linked to as being reissues for... if that makes sense. It'd get really complicated, really quickly.

We'll be updating the rules and help sections to reflect what has been said in this thread so far on "other versions" of albums. Stay tuned.

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MutantClannfear
Blank Czech

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 4:09 am 
 

Well, okay, that seems fair enough. But there's still the general issue of not being able to transfer a specific album entry to an existing group of releases, which I think will become necessary at some point or another.

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orionmetalhead
Metalhead

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 12:34 pm 
 

I have released a tape with a cover in two different colors. The first set of tapes is limited to 20 and the second set is unlimited. Two versions or one version?
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Derigin
The Mountain Man

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 12:51 pm 
 

Two versions is fine. It seems like a distinct repress. I did the same thing with Bathory: the first 1000 copies were released with the yellow goat cover, and an indeterminate amount were repressed not long after with the standard cover. Remember to note the first as a limited edition; that - in addition to the cover art - is what makes it a separate version.

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Erosion of Humanity
Destroyer of the Gods

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:12 pm
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Location: Chicago
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:30 pm 
 

Couple more questions for the mods here:

1) I've noticed a lot of albums have promo versions that are just cardboard sleeves and the disc. I asked about this before but I've noticed that it is almost every release that I've come in contact with. Before I was adding them because I thought they were fairly uncommon but seeing how common they are has are me wonder if it's best just to add it to thr additional notes instead of making a separate entry. Just wanted your thoughts.

2) Would it be possible to open the additional notes field to non veteran users for these circumstances? I know it's not common practice but I feel like it's uber redundant to add all the info then have to file a report to have the field purged of all the info that we're adding with the the releases. Also it avoid having to file reports to add promo versions to the notes on the parent release if you want us to go that route.
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TheSniper1124
Mallcore Kid

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 4:19 pm 
 

I feel as though this question is readily apparent, but I couldn't find it looking through the thread. Is it necessary to add another version of an album if it was released as both a physical and digital? For example if an album is currently listed as a CD or vinyl should another version be added for digital if it exists in both mediums? Many bands take this approach today so I feel as though in some aspects it may cause some redundancy if so many pages have albums that show alternate versions just being CD and digital, but maybe I'm wrong.

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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
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Location: Germany
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:04 pm 
 

TheSniper1124 wrote:
I feel as though this question is readily apparent, but I couldn't find it looking through the thread. Is it necessary to add another version of an album if it was released as both a physical and digital? For example if an album is currently listed as a CD or vinyl should another version be added for digital if it exists in both mediums? Many bands take this approach today so I feel as though in some aspects it may cause some redundancy if so many pages have albums that show alternate versions just being CD and digital, but maybe I'm wrong.

Well, why not? For instance, if some obscure release hits the streets again in the form of a digital download, then why not add it to the release? Maybe the first edition had been some tape, while the recent one appears in FLAC.
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Last edited by oneyoudontknow on Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Derigin
The Mountain Man

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 6:25 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:06 pm 
 

Erosion of Humanity wrote:
Couple more questions for the mods here:

1) I've noticed a lot of albums have promo versions that are just cardboard sleeves and the disc. I asked about this before but I've noticed that it is almost every release that I've come in contact with. Before I was adding them because I thought they were fairly uncommon but seeing how common they are has are me wonder if it's best just to add it to thr additional notes instead of making a separate entry. Just wanted your thoughts.

The honest truth is that this might be something needing to be further looked at. There's a dilemma with that. Let me explain. For a band's discography we require that the albums added to that discography must be valid albums. We hold this same standard for when we accept bands, and it is this site's way of ensuring that whatever albums are listed in the discography are complete, legitimate products that have been released and made available. They exist and can be verified as legitimate. And this is a fine and dandy way of handling the albums listed in a band's discography.

The problem arises about whether we should apply these same standards to versions of valid albums themselves; in other words, should the versions of other albums also be required to be valid? That seems to be the general practice (and current policy), with the exception of the inclusion of unofficial/disputed versions. However, that also begs another question. If we choose to require other versions as valid, are we neglecting the possibility that there are invalid versions that users can get their hands on (ex. promos)? Should we continue to maintain standards for validness across the board or open up the "other versions" of valid albums to include any version of those valid albums? If we do that, is it opening up a barrel of monkeys when it comes to what actually exists and what doesn't? For now our policy on promos is to remove them when they are invalid (incomplete or never released publicly, for example). But I'm not sure. This may need more discussion. For now, my best advice is for folks to add what is obvious under what we consider valid albums for the time being.

TheSniper1124 wrote:
I feel as though this question is readily apparent, but I couldn't find it looking through the thread. Is it necessary to add another version of an album if it was released as both a physical and digital? For example if an album is currently listed as a CD or vinyl should another version be added for digital if it exists in both mediums? Many bands take this approach today so I feel as though in some aspects it may cause some redundancy if so many pages have albums that show alternate versions just being CD and digital, but maybe I'm wrong.

If the version of the album comes with multiple discs/formats, you can add them together. When you go to create a version, simply choose "Multiple" as a format, and add a component under each format as necessary. So if it is a physical release that comes with a digital copy, you can add the physical CD as one component, and the digital tracks as another.

EDIT: It's important to note the difference between a format that comes with another format (they're released together as one release), or two different formats released as separate releases. If it's the former, it's a multiple format version of that album (eg. this CD comes with a digital copy!). If it's the latter, then it's worth adding them as separate versions as that is what they are after all (eg. we released this as a CD and through iTunes).

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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:10 pm 
 

1: CDr != CD
2: CDr = CD
how do you want it?
I have it seen it several times that the versions are changed to "other" instead of CD.

http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Be ... aust/51555
http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Ce ... Rike/80419
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Azmodes
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:12 pm 
 

Obviously under "CD".

Derigin wrote:
TheSniper1124 wrote:
I feel as though this question is readily apparent, but I couldn't find it looking through the thread. Is it necessary to add another version of an album if it was released as both a physical and digital? For example if an album is currently listed as a CD or vinyl should another version be added for digital if it exists in both mediums? Many bands take this approach today so I feel as though in some aspects it may cause some redundancy if so many pages have albums that show alternate versions just being CD and digital, but maybe I'm wrong.

If the version of the album comes with multiple discs/formats, you can add them together. When you go to create a version, simply choose "Multiple" as a format, and add a component under each format as necessary. So if it is a physical release that comes with a digital copy, you can add the physical CD as one component, and the digital tracks as another.

Also, if digital and physical copies are available separately, there is no problem with adding the digital one as a new release version.
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Derigin
The Mountain Man

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:14 pm 
 

Added point to Az's point. Format is CD, mention CD-R in the "version description".

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Erosion of Humanity
Destroyer of the Gods

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:12 pm
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:47 pm 
 

Derigin wrote:
Erosion of Humanity wrote:
Couple more questions for the mods here:

1) I've noticed a lot of albums have promo versions that are just cardboard sleeves and the disc. I asked about this before but I've noticed that it is almost every release that I've come in contact with. Before I was adding them because I thought they were fairly uncommon but seeing how common they are has are me wonder if it's best just to add it to thr additional notes instead of making a separate entry. Just wanted your thoughts.

The honest truth is that this might be something needing to be further looked at. There's a dilemma with that. Let me explain. For a band's discography we require that the albums added to that discography must be valid albums. We hold this same standard for when we accept bands, and it is this site's way of ensuring that whatever albums are listed in the discography are complete, legitimate products that have been released and made available. They exist and can be verified as legitimate. And this is a fine and dandy way of handling the albums listed in a band's discography.

The problem arises about whether we should apply these same standards to versions of valid albums themselves; in other words, should the versions of other albums also be required to be valid? That seems to be the general practice (and current policy), with the exception of the inclusion of unofficial/disputed versions. However, that also begs another question. If we choose to require other versions as valid, are we neglecting the possibility that there are invalid versions that users can get their hands on (ex. promos)? Should we continue to maintain standards for validness across the board or open up the "other versions" of valid albums to include any version of those valid albums? If we do that, is it opening up a barrel of monkeys when it comes to what actually exists and what doesn't? For now our policy on promos is to remove them when they are invalid (incomplete or never released publicly, for example). But I'm not sure. This may need more discussion. For now, my best advice is for folks to add what is obvious under what we consider valid albums for the time being.


Yeah it seems to be a catch 22 either way you look at it. I've only been adding the ones that are released by the labels (i.e. Nuclear Blast) so hopefully in the end that'll help with the weeding out process. I'm also a bit confused by your wording here, maybe it's just me misunderstanding but why wouldn't a promo be valid? Is it because it was never for sale and just given out? Wouldn't that still count as valid distribution especially since it's from a major label? I guess it's just the fact that it's on a label that makes me confused, like if it was Bob's cd palace putting it out I could see it being unofficial or a bootleg.

For what it's worth as well I think it would be a good idea for you to allow the bootlegs and unofficial releases. Now this is just one man's opinion but I know that when I'm looking for info on a CD or whatever other format it may be my gut reaction is to hit up MA. Now if I'm looking for general info this site is good but if I'm trying to find out if something is fake then I gotta go elsewhere. Not really a big deal but I think it would be nice to see them listed here of course red flagged to hell and back. It would just make it easier to not get ripped off I feel, that and well you are an encyclopedia, listing the fact that there are fakes out there would make sense to me. Again just food for thought.
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