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Subrick
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:27 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:20 am 
 

The Transformers movies are fascinating to me in that just about every single movie is a top contender for the worst summer blockbuster of all time, and they somehow get even worse and more insufferable with each new movie. I haven’t seen Bumblebee, but hearing that one is actually a great movie blew my mind considering the utter trash that preceded it.
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Xlxlx
Argentinian Asado Supremacy

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:16 pm
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Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am 
 

Erosion of Humanity wrote:
Why put effort into it though? You've got to hand it to Disney here, they've got this on lock, they have proven twice now that they can put out steaming piles of shit, slap the Star Wars name on it, and rake in the big dollars. They have no reason to even attempt at making it good. Especially when you have morons using terms like "toxic fans" because people are only allowed to like things now, or something.

To be fair though, the "toxic fans" moniker arised mainly after people started harassing the actors out of social media, and particularly the women, at that.
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MikeyC
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:55 am 
 

Subrick wrote:
The Transformers movies are fascinating to me in that just about every single movie is a top contender for the worst summer blockbuster of all time, and they somehow get even worse and more insufferable with each new movie.

This is true but also sad. I mean, what's not to love about big metal robots fighting each other on the big screen, with today's CGI attached to it? These movies could be amazing. But...you know, Michael Bay.
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Resident_Hazard
Possessed by Starscream's Ghost

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:33 pm
Posts: 2863
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:47 am 
 

Subrick wrote:
The Transformers movies are fascinating to me in that just about every single movie is a top contender for the worst summer blockbuster of all time, and they somehow get even worse and more insufferable with each new movie. I haven’t seen Bumblebee, but hearing that one is actually a great movie blew my mind considering the utter trash that preceded it.


Bumblebee is outstanding. It pays respect to the franchise, and the opening sequence on Cybertron is like glass of water after a decade in the desert to a Transformers fan. The story may be familiar (similar to ET), but the characters, emotion, and story-telling are all great. While it could've used a tad more action, what we got was still leagues better than what Michael Bay gave us.

I'd rate the franchise in this order:

1. Transformers 1986
2. Bumblebee
3. Transfomers 2007
4. Dark of the Moon (part 3)
5. Age of Extinction (4)
6. Last Knight (5)
7. Revenge of the Fallen (2)

The bottom three are practically unwatchable, and picking out which is worse is actually nearly impossible. Last Knight is almost 3 hours long and still feels like a rushed mess.
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Subrick
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:27 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:41 pm 
 

Revenge of the Fallen is the one I see talked about most as an all time terrible movie. It has the most memorable awful stuff in it too out of the bottom three you listed (Shia LaBeouf's mom freaking out on edibles, Skids and Mudflap as minstrel show Autobots, Shia LaBeouf going to robot heaven, etc.). I think it's because the first movie, while bad, is at least still kind of watchable at times. Revenge of the Fallen is a complete fucking mess of a movie, and that probably shocked people who were expecting something that was at least on the same level as the first movie.
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Resident_Hazard
Possessed by Starscream's Ghost

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:33 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:48 pm 
 

Subrick wrote:
Revenge of the Fallen is the one I see talked about most as an all time terrible movie. It has the most memorable awful stuff in it too out of the bottom three you listed (Shia LaBeouf's mom freaking out on edibles, Skids and Mudflap as minstrel show Autobots, Shia LaBeouf going to robot heaven, etc.). I think it's because the first movie, while bad, is at least still kind of watchable at times. Revenge of the Fallen is a complete fucking mess of a movie, and that probably shocked people who were expecting something that was at least on the same level as the first movie.


Michael Bay blamed a writers strike at the time, but he seems to have forgotten that Michael Bay was still directing.
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rexxz
Where's your band?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:06 pm 
 

I am super stoked to go see The Rise of Skywalker when it comes out. I just rewatched TFA and TLJ again and they completely reinforced my opinions on them; really fun movies that do the Star Wars franchise proper justice and continue the story in really interesting and cool ways. TLJ might even be my favorite of the new SW stuff so far if I am being honest. I think Rian Johnson did a phenomenal job and would really love to see him do another one.
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Zdan
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:05 pm
Posts: 2221
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:22 pm 
 

rexxz wrote:
I am super stoked to go see The Rise of Skywalker when it comes out. I just rewatched TFA and TLJ again and they completely reinforced my opinions on them; really fun movies that do the Star Wars franchise proper justice and continue the story in really interesting and cool ways. TLJ might even be my favorite of the new SW stuff so far if I am being honest. I think Rian Johnson did a phenomenal job and would really love to see him do another one.


Honestly it is cool to hear that somebody likes those movies. After rewatching them I consider them vile abominations that killed Star Wars (but I liked Rogue One!) and I think The Rise Of Skywalker will shoot the zombie in the head but if people like those - more power to them!

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rexxz
Where's your band?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:24 pm 
 

Yeah, millions of people like those movies. It's not really that uncommon...?
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Zdan
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:05 pm
Posts: 2221
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 2:44 pm 
 

rexxz wrote:
Yeah, millions of people like those movies. It's not really that uncommon...?


Eh. I may be biased but most of the stuff I have seen on the Internet and in person was not exactly positive towards those films. Maybe its just me and my friends but none of them liked those. I will go back to my hole now as I do not want to rain on your parade.

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:13 pm 
 

If nobody liked them then they wouldn't keep making them. Like anything popular, there'll be a wide variety of opinions.
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Zelkiiro
Pounding the world with a fish of steel

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:27 pm 
 

The Last Jedi and Rogue One are on par with A New Hope.

Don't @ me.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:30 pm 
 

Zelkiiro wrote:
The Last Jedi and Rogue One are on par with A New Hope.

Don't @ me.


Pretty much... I just see them as entertaining, thrilling action flicks. Others who are super invested in the entire mythology may have a different view but for a popcorn flick, both are killer.
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The_Apex_of_Collapse
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:34 pm 
 

Man, TLJ completely killed off all the set up of TFA and made potential characters like Snoke, and Phasma meaningless. hardcore fans can be hard to take but they are not wrong on TLJ in my opinion. The pacing, useless side story, and the awful idea of sending a ship to light speed to take out another rendering all space battles pointless past, and future. Just bad decisions all around.

That being said, hope JJ pulls off a miracle and makes both sides of the camp happy. Should have just had a single director at the helm instead of having another come in and "subvert expectations"
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OzzyApu
Metal freak

Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:11 am
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Location: Seattle
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 1:52 am 
 

Those saying TLJ was a great film I'm wondering if we saw different movies. It was awful, and Rogue One was soulless. R1 was super boring despite whatever action was going on, and TLJ took a few minutes to sink in just how bad that was. That whole Canto Bight segment alone was a horrible side plot. Having read the leaks on Rise of Skywalker it also sounds like a terrible fan fiction, especially the ending. I remember when TFA came out and it to me was like a great (if huge retread) relief after the prequels. But that's as far as my praise would go with how Disney has handled this series. I think they've done far more damage to the franchise.
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Unorthodox
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:08 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 2:11 am 
 

I liked TFA, but TLJ was grade A horseshit, easily the worst Star Wars movie ever released. It was the first Star Wars that, about 3/4ths through, I wanted to just end because I was so bored.

To say any Star Wars film was as good as A New Hope is not seeing that movie in the context of when it came out. I wasn't exactly alive back then, but you can still tell to this day that nothing remotely close was like it until it got released. Now in 2019 the whole sci-fi thing has been beaten to a bloody pulp and is beyond stale as a genre. Even a lot of dystopian sci fi feels cliche and boring now.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 3:07 am 
 

I just rewatched TLJ and it's wild how different opinions and whatnot are. I thought it was marvelous. It was basically Rian Johnson taking something he probably watched a thousand times, and the somewhat rigid tropes of TFA, and contorting it into a story about bucking the archaic ways of the past and just saying fuck it to the established order, which was sort of a poignant thing for these times. It worked really well for me even now just watching it at home and not on a big screen. I tend to look for the bigger overall picture like that.

And with Star Wars I just doubt anyone would've been happy no matter what. People hated the prequels and wanted a "normal" Star Wars again. Then you got the cries about TFA that it was nothing but a rehash. Then this one did some different things (not even that much, but just tastefully so) and people bitch about that. It's not to disparage anyone's individual tastes, but really, Star Wars is such a monolith of pop culture and so woven into many of our childhoods, that anything will seem weak in comparison to the rosy nostalgia of our younger days. We imagined shit different in our heads making up stories as kids. These movies had their own ideas and so people get disappointed.
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Razakel
Nekroprince

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:36 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 3:44 am 
 

Unorthodox wrote:
I liked TFA, but TLJ was grade A horseshit, easily the worst Star Wars movie ever released.


I mean, let's not forget about Episode II here lol. But yeah, TLJ was totally insulting. Not just a terrible Star Wars movie, but just a really stupid, bad movie no matter how you look at it. The "story" is a boring car chase (because apparently the New Order forgot they had lightspeed) and the characterization is cringe-inducing. The nail in the coffin is the wretched Marvel movie humour sprinkled over every fucking line of dialogue. Ugh. And that casino planet...just...what? I hate thinking about that movie.

Solo also kinda sucked but at least it was fun by comparison. Not very high hopes for Rise of Skywalker, unfortunately. I'm expecting massive amounts of fan service and retconning of stuff Rian Johnson fucked up in Episode VIII. Maybe it'll be fun while watching in the theatre, but I'd be pretty damn surprised if it ends up feeling like a satisfying conclusion to the whole saga.

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Xenophon
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:07 am
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:22 am 
 

Razakel wrote:
I'm expecting massive amounts of fan service and retconning of stuff Rian Johnson fucked up in Episode VIII.

Yeah, watching them hand the saga over to two directors to play tug-of-war over it has been really frustrating and detrimental to the films' quality. It's also crazy how huge the drop in revenue was from TFA to TLJ. According to Wikipedia, the box office amount TLJ made was 735 million dollars less than TFA. I wonder if that's the largest ever decease in box office revenue from one film to the one directly following in a series. It seems like that was when they started pulling back a little on the Star Wars and realized it wasn't going to be a cash cow they could do whatever they wanted with and still make huge bucks indefinitely.

Also, apparently Kathleen Kennedy said this recently:
Quote:
Every one of these movies is a particularly hard nut to crack. There’s no source material. We don’t have comic books. We don’t have 800-page novels. We don’t have anything other than passionate storytellers who get together and talk about what the next iteration might be.

https://www.rollingstone.com/movies/movie-news/lucasfilm-president-kathleen-kennedy-interview-rise-skywalker-future-star-wars-912393/

At first I wasn't sure if it was a fake article or something when I saw the quote, but nope, it's real. Hopefully whenever they make another streak of main series films they give it to a person or a team with a more coherent vision, like Markus and McFeely did for several of the Marvel films (including the Infinity War/Endgame two-parter). And the old expanded universe may have a lot of shit, but I'm sure there are good ideas to mine from there too and piece together into an original story, kind of like how the Marvel movies are made.

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droneriot
incelgender

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:17 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:33 am 
 

Xenophon wrote:
Hopefully whenever they make another streak of main series films they give it to a person or a team with a more coherent vision, like Markus and McFeely did for several of the Marvel films (including the Infinity War/Endgame two-parter). And the old expanded universe may have a lot of shit, but I'm sure there are good ideas to mine from there too and piece together into an original story, kind of like how the Marvel movies are made.

Well they already say Feige will do a Star Wars film. Then again they said so many things, if all their announcements had substance we'd have like 48 Star Wars films out or in the making by now.
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Morrigan
Crone of War

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:02 am 
 

The Last Jedi is so much better than The Force Awakens, it's not even funny. It had one or two cringy scenes (Leia floating in space and that lame part with Rose and Finn), but was otherwise a fine, fun movie.

Rogue One is the better movie of the newer ones though, if only for the Vader fanservice. I'd rank them R1 > TLJ > Solo >>>>> TFA
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Zdan
Metalhead

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:09 am 
 

Empyreal wrote:
If nobody liked them then they wouldn't keep making them. Like anything popular, there'll be a wide variety of opinions.


Never said nobody liked them. I just have not met people who were really into them. Just that.

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droneriot
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:20 am 
 

From Rogue One I remember the blind Asian guy and his friend, and Alan Tudyk bot, liked those. Nothing else stuck with me. Solo it's like... One time I mixed a bit of garlic into the dog food because I read it could help against fleas, and the dog smelled it and stepped back horrified and you could see it working inside her head like "okay it's in the dog food bowl, I'm a dog, I eat dog food, I gotta eat this" and then she went and ate the whole thing like a soldier. Watching Solo to the end was kind of like that for me. Like X-Men Origins: Wolverine I have no complaints about any of the ideas in the movie and it's just a simple case of "who actually gives a shit about seeing this story?"
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kalervon
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:43 pm
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 8:06 am 
 

Morrigan wrote:
Rogue One is the better movie of the newer ones though, if only for the Vader fanservice.

It was no fan service, it just happened to be a story in which he was involved.

As for TLJ, it beat any SW movie or cartoon in terms of lame plot holes, and that's no small feat - the original 3 were made in days where it was assumed people could only watch them a limited number of times (personal VCRs were just about to become common when RTJ came out) and had no internet on which to complain, and yet each was more consistent than TLJ.

I rank TLJ with episodes 1 & 2 in terms of movies that would not get any attention whatsoever if they weren't in the franchise, assuming they would have gotten made.
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henkkjelle
Veteran

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:06 am 
 

The (admittedly awesome) Vader scene was total fan service. So much so that the rest of the movie felt like a two hour set-up for it.

Edit: Can we at least all agree that The Mandalorian is the actual best new Star Wars thing?

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BastardHead
Worse than the PMRC

Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 7:53 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:19 am 
 

Xenophon wrote:
Also, apparently Kathleen Kennedy said this recently:
Quote:
Every one of these movies is a particularly hard nut to crack. There’s no source material. We don’t have comic books. We don’t have 800-page novels. We don’t have anything other than passionate storytellers who get together and talk about what the next iteration might be.

https://www.rollingstone.com/movies/movie-news/lucasfilm-president-kathleen-kennedy-interview-rise-skywalker-future-star-wars-912393/

At first I wasn't sure if it was a fake article or something when I saw the quote, but nope, it's real.


Well I mean... she isn't wrong? She's wrong in the sense that yes there is a ton of material in the EU but also not wrong because Disney made it very clear way back when they bought the property that the EU was basically non canon going forward. They made a conscious choice to discard all of the other stuff outside of the main films and to expand the universe in accordance with their own vision on their own terms. Whether or not that was a good choice is something for fans to decide, but she's totally right when she says that they aren't retelling stories from other sources and are instead doing their own thing.

I'm not really much of a Star Wars fan (though I have a lot of childhood nostalgia for the OT and I've seen (and hated) all of the prequels, but haven't seen any of the Disney era stuff) so I don't really have any skin in the game here, but what I know of the two movies makes me think I'd like TLJ a lot more anyway. All signs point to TFA being a shameless retread of ANH with some new faces, while TLJ really threw the stories in a new direction kicking and screaming. I'd definitely prefer to see something new than something I've already seen before except shinier. Maybe the execution was awful, I dunno, I haven't seen it, but I like it a lot more in theory. I can sympathize with cool characters being wasted but lol at the collective brainwipe in the fandom when it comes to the OT doing the same damn thing to Boba Fett. Y'all forget he had like six seconds of screen time and his main accomplishments were standing there and dying?

And y'all can say what you will now since the possibility is moot now that Johnson did the second movie already, but I don't think y'all would've wanted Abrams to do the whole thing anyway. Dude is notorious for interesting setups with god awful payoffs. Sounds like y'all got your hearts broken one film early is all.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:36 am 
 

^ Exactly, on the Boba Fett thing. People think it's a new thing for Star Wars to put in cool characters who don't really do much for the plot at all.
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Xenophon
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 1:34 pm 
 

BastardHead wrote:
Xenophon wrote:
Also, apparently Kathleen Kennedy said this recently:
Quote:
Every one of these movies is a particularly hard nut to crack. There’s no source material. We don’t have comic books. We don’t have 800-page novels. We don’t have anything other than passionate storytellers who get together and talk about what the next iteration might be.

https://www.rollingstone.com/movies/movie-news/lucasfilm-president-kathleen-kennedy-interview-rise-skywalker-future-star-wars-912393/

At first I wasn't sure if it was a fake article or something when I saw the quote, but nope, it's real.


Well I mean... she isn't wrong? She's wrong in the sense that yes there is a ton of material in the EU but also not wrong because Disney made it very clear way back when they bought the property that the EU was basically non canon going forward. They made a conscious choice to discard all of the other stuff outside of the main films and to expand the universe in accordance with their own vision on their own terms. Whether or not that was a good choice is something for fans to decide, but she's totally right when she says that they aren't retelling stories from other sources and are instead doing their own thing.

I'm not really much of a Star Wars fan (though I have a lot of childhood nostalgia for the OT and I've seen (and hated) all of the prequels, but haven't seen any of the Disney era stuff) so I don't really have any skin in the game here, but what I know of the two movies makes me think I'd like TLJ a lot more anyway. All signs point to TFA being a shameless retread of ANH with some new faces, while TLJ really threw the stories in a new direction kicking and screaming. I'd definitely prefer to see something new than something I've already seen before except shinier. Maybe the execution was awful, I dunno, I haven't seen it, but I like it a lot more in theory. I can sympathize with cool characters being wasted but lol at the collective brainwipe in the fandom when it comes to the OT doing the same damn thing to Boba Fett. Y'all forget he had like six seconds of screen time and his main accomplishments were standing there and dying?

And y'all can say what you will now since the possibility is moot now that Johnson did the second movie already, but I don't think y'all would've wanted Abrams to do the whole thing anyway. Dude is notorious for interesting setups with god awful payoffs. Sounds like y'all got your hearts broken one film early is all.

Uhh what guys? Boba Fett was pretty damn important to the plot of Episode V. It's not like a character needs many lines to be a good character or something. The whole point of Boba Fett was to create a character with minimalist dialogue and backstory but a comparatively impactful presence. The main reason people like him was that he questioned Darth Vader and got away with it (in contrast with the officer in ANH who questioned Vader and got Force-choked). In one simple line, he really establishes himself as a character and a presence in the film. Captain Phasma is not bad but by comparison is just a lesser rehash, just like a lot of stuff in TFA.

Also, none of the Marvel comics are canon to the films either. Marvel routinely creates new canons (Earth-616, Earth-39811, etc.) for its comics, TV series, etc., which the films are free to either borrow from or ignore. Also, Disney didn't throw out all of the old EU ideas (e.g. Thrawn was reintroduced in the Rebels series and in a new series of novels). Marvel and the new Star Wars are in the exact same boat when it comes to source material. It's just that the new main SW films decided not to use anything from them. Not to mention, both of the films rehash so much stuff from the original six movies that it doesn't make sense to say they threw everything out and created something new. That's what they pretended to do, while copying tons of stuff from previous movies (and arguably from Spaceballs lol).

However, maybe it's true that having Abrams direct all three wouldn't have worked any better. (I assume you're referring to Lost when you say he creates interesting setups with terrible payoffs? I don't think I've seen any of his other works that have a large build-up to something--I guess Super 8 but I don't remember that film too well and I think I only saw part of it.)

FWIW I do think the first two prequels are a bit worse than the two new sequels. I've never seen 1 and 2 as "bad" movies, but they definitely have their own problems, one of the most glaring of which is the ridiculous dialogue, which is so infamously bad there's a very popular subreddit that has been dedicated to making memes about it, which has been going for at least three years strong and somehow keeps finding new lines to meme-ify and mock.

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Ilwhyan
Metel fraek

Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 1:41 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:17 pm 
 

Xenophon wrote:
The main reason people like [Boba Fett] was that he questioned Darth Vader and got away with it (in contrast with the officer in ANH who questioned Vader and got Force-choked). In one simple line, he really establishes himself as a character and a presence in the film.

Which scene are you referring to here?
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Xenophon
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:25 pm 
 

Ilwhyan wrote:
Xenophon wrote:
The main reason people like [Boba Fett] was that he questioned Darth Vader and got away with it (in contrast with the officer in ANH who questioned Vader and got Force-choked). In one simple line, he really establishes himself as a character and a presence in the film.

Which scene are you referring to here?

The "He's no good to me dead" exchange.

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Morrigan
Crone of War

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:11 pm 
 

Star Wars fans have been making Boba Fett a bigger deal than he actually is since times immemorial lol.

He's just a dude with a cool armour and that's how he got so popular, period. In truth he's a jobber.
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Von Cichlid wrote:
I work with plenty of Oriental and Indian persons and we get along pretty good, and some females as well.

Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
a fairly agreed upon date [of the beginning of metal] is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old

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Xlxlx
Argentinian Asado Supremacy

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:55 pm 
 

Yeah, I never understood why anyone ever gave a shit about Boba Fett. He's a non-presence.

Durge from the Tartakovsky Star Wars shorts was a thousand times cooler, and he actually did some cool shit, like fighting clone troopers on a hoverbike with a goddamn lance like some sort of space knight and, oh yeah, trying to eat Kenobi alive.
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The instruments used are what you would expect from the little metal people: guitaloos, bassnaps, drumdrums, and voclatrons. The best things about the guitaloos are obviously the riffraffs.

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Xenophon
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 6:16 pm 
 

Nah Boba Fett's mystique is unrivaled. But yeah Durge is super cool too. His fight with Obi-Wan was probably my favorite part of that Tartovsky Clone Wars series. That show introduced some really badass villains among him, Grievous, and of course Asajj fucking Ventress (another character whose sheer badassery and mystique renders any need for a backstory null).

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PDS
The Folk One

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 2:05 am 
 

There’s a TLJ deleted scene with Phasma that is absolutely excellent, adds more to her character and everything. Considering the fact that Phasma got herself an entire book before TLJ came out already makes it seem that Rian had no idea how to use her.

I’m not in either camp. TLJ is immensely enjoyable and I enjoyed it more than TFA, but there’s a shit ton of stupid ideas in the plot and so many dumb subversions of expectations that makes it seem like written by an edgy teenager. “They’re gonna expect this, but the opposite is gonna happen, huhuhuhu. I’m so smart.”
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Acrobat wrote:
I dunno, I'm a guitarist and it always feels like playing a giant cock. Not just that but live music should hit you in the genitals. It might not if you don't use good amplifiers and your modelling shit goes straight out of the PA. But good music hits you HARD in the GENITALS.

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waiguoren
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 6:54 am 
 

In 1979, a year before the release of Empire, Boba Fett's action figure was the first one released by Kenner for the next movie. Besides looking cool as fuck and being in the best - arguably the only great - Star Wars movie, back then you had to guess what the hell the Clone Wars were, what Mandalorian armor meant, etc. Things were shrouded in mystery, which was (in my opinion) better than having them revealed to us through the prequels and cartoon shows.
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Empyreal
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 1:43 pm 
 

PDS wrote:

I’m not in either camp. TLJ is immensely enjoyable and I enjoyed it more than TFA, but there’s a shit ton of stupid ideas in the plot and so many dumb subversions of expectations that makes it seem like written by an edgy teenager. “They’re gonna expect this, but the opposite is gonna happen, huhuhuhu. I’m so smart.”


I disagree, I don't think it felt like that at all. All of the choices made felt natural and not edgy at all - they were done to advance a point, not just as "weird subversions."

It's still corny and cheesy as much as any Star Wars (and Johnson leans into this, which I suspect is why some people disliked it) but for an action blockbuster, I don't see many that have such solid ideas behind them for the overall arc and message.
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Morrigan
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 3:49 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
I disagree, I don't think it felt like that at all. All of the choices made felt natural and not edgy at all - they were done to advance a point, not just as "weird subversions."

It's still corny and cheesy as much as any Star Wars (and Johnson leans into this, which I suspect is why some people disliked it) but for an action blockbuster, I don't see many that have such solid ideas behind them for the overall arc and message.

Agreed with this.
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Von Cichlid wrote:
I work with plenty of Oriental and Indian persons and we get along pretty good, and some females as well.

Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
a fairly agreed upon date [of the beginning of metal] is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old

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The_Apex_of_Collapse
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2009 11:29 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 4:52 pm 
 

I think we can all agree that TLJ did one thing that was so amazing that no other property had done to that point and that was create such a schism in its fanbase.
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Xlxlx
Argentinian Asado Supremacy

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:16 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 5:00 pm 
 

Xenophon wrote:
Nah Boba Fett's mystique is unrivaled. But yeah Durge is super cool too. His fight with Obi-Wan was probably my favorite part of that Tartovsky Clone Wars series. That show introduced some really badass villains among him, Grievous, and of course Asajj fucking Ventress (another character whose sheer badassery and mystique renders any need for a backstory null).

Oh yeah, I remember seeing General Grievous for the first time in that episode where he just fucking massacres a Jedi squad by himself and going completely apeshit, like "oh my god this guy is so awesome please put him in a movie". I believe I surprise no one by saying I was deeply, deeply disappointed with his portrayal in Revenge of the Sith. Such a cool character, wasted.

Ventress was also great, loved the parallels drawn between her and Anakin in the Tartakovsky shorts. Fett still kinda sucks though, sorry :-P
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droneriot wrote:
The instruments used are what you would expect from the little metal people: guitaloos, bassnaps, drumdrums, and voclatrons. The best things about the guitaloos are obviously the riffraffs.

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PDS
The Folk One

Joined: Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:04 pm
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Location: A forest on an island!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 5:35 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
PDS wrote:

I’m not in either camp. TLJ is immensely enjoyable and I enjoyed it more than TFA, but there’s a shit ton of stupid ideas in the plot and so many dumb subversions of expectations that makes it seem like written by an edgy teenager. “They’re gonna expect this, but the opposite is gonna happen, huhuhuhu. I’m so smart.”


I disagree, I don't think it felt like that at all. All of the choices made felt natural and not edgy at all - they were done to advance a point, not just as "weird subversions."

It's still corny and cheesy as much as any Star Wars (and Johnson leans into this, which I suspect is why some people disliked it) but for an action blockbuster, I don't see many that have such solid ideas behind them for the overall arc and message.


Okay yeah, it's a bit of hyperbole on my part (blame typing in the early morning for that one) but the use of subversion of expectation is pretty big in there, maybe not edgy but it's definitely a big thing in overall. I wrote like a whole list on how it plays a role in many aspects of the film I'm going to just say that many of them don't work for me (emphasis on me) mainly due to because either A. There was not a lot of set-up (Audiance initial trust in Holdo, Snoke going out with a whimper), B. The set-up was pretty bad (OG Master Cracker introduction)

There are good ones, like Luke's explanation on shying away from the force, the second hacker's introduction, and Poe's failures etc.

Thinking now with a early afternoon and freshly hydrated mind, really my complaints are ones that could have explanation after if JJ wants to pull something out of his ass (well, except the master hacker initial reveal). If anything, I have used this morning to help gather my feeling on why I like TLJ, but also in some cases also pretty annoyed by it.

Change my opinion on the plot as 'mixed' now instead of 'negative'.
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Acrobat wrote:
I dunno, I'm a guitarist and it always feels like playing a giant cock. Not just that but live music should hit you in the genitals. It might not if you don't use good amplifiers and your modelling shit goes straight out of the PA. But good music hits you HARD in the GENITALS.

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