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Derigin
The Mountain Man

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 6:25 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:02 pm 
 

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-e ... d-n1131261

"Oh Bernie looks like he's gonna edge into a win... better recanvass right now!"
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l Lunaris l
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:14 pm
Posts: 68
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:24 pm 
 

Sedition and Pockets wrote:
What isn't clear from that quote, but is true nonetheless, is that the "private quarters" are still in men's shelters, which means trans women using them, even on nights where there isn't an overflow situation, still have to weigh the significant risk factor involved. The situation becomes more problematic when you consider that overflow shelters typically are only opened up on nights where there is an elevated risk that folks will freeze or otherwise die from the hazards of exposure. Forcing trans women into men's shelters is a bad business no matter how you look at it, and it exacerbates a major underlying structural problem in our care for the homeless in this country, i.e. the fact that in most cities, a substantial majority of shelter beds are allocated solely to women and families, although single men make up the majority of the chronically homeless. Given the wildly disproportionate presence of trans folks among the ranks of the unhoused, this further strains a particularly overburdened part of the system, as well as devaluing and placing trans women in danger.


So I might just be stupid but... what exactly is the "danger" trans women would face from this? What is the "risk factor"? It's an insult and degrading, yes, but I don't know what you could be referring to here.
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Sedition and Pockets
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 8:29 am
Posts: 386
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:27 pm 
 

You don't see the risk factor inherent in putting women in a men's homeless shelter?

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l Lunaris l
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:14 pm
Posts: 68
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:36 pm 
 

Sedition and Pockets wrote:
You don't see the risk factor inherent in putting women in a men's homeless shelter?


They're anatomically male, aren't they? They shouldn't be there, but they're under no greater risk than any of the men.

One could even make the argument that sorting people anatomically saves trans men from that risk you just mentioned, but I'm not gonna get into that.
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Derigin
The Mountain Man

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 6:25 am
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:40 pm 
 

Just because you're anatomically male doesn't mean you can't be raped, abused, beaten, harassed, assaulted, or bullied.

And all of those are sadly more common for trans people, especially transwomen among men.
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l Lunaris l
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:14 pm
Posts: 68
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:51 pm 
 

Derigin wrote:
Just because you're anatomically male doesn't mean you can't be raped, abused, beaten, harassed, assaulted, or bullied.

And all of those are sadly more common for trans people, especially transwomen among men.


I was not aware. I guess I just assumed the risk would be about the same if they were physically the same.
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Sedition and Pockets
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 8:29 am
Posts: 386
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:51 pm 
 

l Lunaris l wrote:
Sedition and Pockets wrote:
You don't see the risk factor inherent in putting women in a men's homeless shelter?


They're anatomically male, aren't they? They shouldn't be there, but they're under no greater risk than any of the men.


The statistics suggest otherwise. 1 of 2 trans women experience sexual assault in their lifetimes. The risk factor for trans women and cis men in a men's shelter is NOT the same. I've done that dance before, don't need it in my life ever again. I'd have to think long and hard before I spent a night in a men's shelter, even if I had access to a private, secure space. Conditions would have to be dire indeed for me to even consider a night in an overflow situation.

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insanewayne253
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:04 am
Posts: 98
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:38 pm 
 

Derigin wrote:
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/buttigieg-sanders-neck-neck-iowa-nearly-all-votes-reported-n1131261

"Oh Bernie looks like he's gonna edge into a win... better recanvass right now!"


In a way I kinda don’t blame Perez. This whole Iowa Caucus was an absolute clusterfuck and a simple primary should’ve solved this with a clear winner. That app they were using should be dropped immediately.

...still don’t think there was some ratfucking going on in Iowa? (I know it’s Fox News, but i’m Never afraid to go into the lion’s den once in awhile.
https://apple.news/A37AyxLBQT6WhmbPt4oHdig

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Resident_Hazard
Possessed by Starscream's Ghost

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:33 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:21 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
Quote:
I used to really like Mayor Pete, but a lot of that has eroded and Bernie Sanders clearly stands above the rest as a candidate with serious morality, unwavering ethics, and a history of consistency in his fights. There was analogy I saw that said Mayor Pete is what Boomers want Millennials to be like. I think that statement is right on the nose. And that is a huge red flag. I'll take the actual Boomer that knows what Millennials need.

I strongly recommend you watch Bernie's response to Tuesday's SotU, especially it you're concerned that Bernie won't be tough enough on lynchpin issues such as protecting a women's right to choose, common sense gun control legislation, as well as his greatest hits about the economy.


I actually have no doubts that Bernie will kick a lot of ass and be tough in all the right ways.

Would you happen to have a link to that anyway?
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Resident_Hazard
Possessed by Starscream's Ghost

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:30 pm 
 

l Lunaris l wrote:
Derigin wrote:
Just because you're anatomically male doesn't mean you can't be raped, abused, beaten, harassed, assaulted, or bullied.

And all of those are sadly more common for trans people, especially transwomen among men.


I was not aware. I guess I just assumed the risk would be about the same if they were physically the same.


They're not physically the same. Transwomen take estrogen hormones and while some may retain some former masculine muscle strength, it would be folly to assume they're just as strong or aggressive as a man. Transwomen and transmen should not be forced to be around cis men or women just because they were born with the same genitals. Particularly in an at-risk population like this, where marginalized by society and homeless, they are more likely dealing with depression, dysphoria, or other issues.

This is really not different from putting any other woman in the men's quarters.
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Burnyoursins
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:59 am
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:34 pm 
 

And also, given that transpeople regularly face discrimination and harassment at the best of times, how do you think they'll fare among a bunch of other people hanging by a thread themselves?
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The_Beast_in_Black wrote:
SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
...no one still knows what it's supposed to be about.

Well, I reckon there's a pretty good chance it'll be about gory tits.

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nestee8
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2014 7:05 pm
Posts: 281
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:52 pm 
 

Random post, but can someone explain this? https://www.opensecrets.org/2020-presid ... =N00000528

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Subrick
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:27 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:15 pm 
 

Says it right on the page: "The money came from the organizations' PACs; their individual members, employees or owners; and those individuals' immediate families." A quick Google search after that shows that the employees of these giant corporations that Bernie shittalks are the ones donating to him. If you worked at Amazon and donated $5 to Bernie, or if you worked there and your significant other donated $5, that $5 will show up on that donor list as being from Amazon.

https://www.newsweek.com/amazon-employe ... gn-1480133
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Bingewolf
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:59 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:54 pm 
 

Iowa Results:
First Vote: Bernie - 43,671 (24.8%) | Pete - 37,557 (21.3%)
Second Vote: Bernie - 45,826 (26.6%) | Pete - 43,195 (25%)
State Delegates: Bernie - 11 (562 SDEs) | Pete - 11 (564 SDEs)

CNN: "Buttigieg holds on to narrow lead with 100% reporting in Iowa."

It is crazy that Bernie won both rounds of the actual vote and tied Pete when it comes to state delegates. It's even crazier that the person who lost both rounds of popular vote and tied in delegates would get more SDEs... It's - somehow - even crazier that media outlets are running "Pete wins" headlines when these are what the results were.

I think we should base results on the popular vote. However, I understand that isn't the current circumstance so I can come to terms that they each got 11 delegates due to the closeness of the percentage of final votes. I just don't get why SDEs are the only metric that people would use to justify who wins. Even at the convention, Iowa will have 41 delegates - and each Bernie and Pete will get 11 - so who gives a fuck about SDEs?

This process certainly seems to seal the deal that the caucus is the dumbest way of voting that humans have invented yet...

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Unorthodox
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:08 pm
Posts: 1510
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 12:18 am 
 

AP isn't confirming a winner due to inconsistent data while Tom Perez is calling for a recanvassing. I await to see where this will go, everything is still up in the air.

What I don't get is how anyone can look at Mayor Pete in a positive light after claiming victory before even the slightest indication that he did well. He made a total ass of himself, but is somehow surging in the betting odds along with Bloomberg. I think the real winner of the caucus was Steve Kornacki of MSNBC. Seriously, the dude deserves a raise just for the amount of bullshit he's been having to put up with the last few days.
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Smalley
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Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:06 am
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:06 am 
 

Subrick wrote:
Buttchug's saying he won
Dude, grow up...

...if you're going to give Mayo Pete an insulting last name, use an actual clever one, like "Bootyjudge".

:-D
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darkeningday
xXdArKenIngDayXx

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:35 am 
 

A bunch of liberals got Matt Christman suspended on Twitter for writing Buttchug. They accused him of homophobia.

If those people think butt-chugging has anything to do with homosexuality, they need to spend 15 minutes at a richboy frathouse. It's possibly the best insult for an Ivy League PMC piece of shit out there :lol:
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l Lunaris l
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:14 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:23 am 
 

Resident_Hazard wrote:
l Lunaris l wrote:
Derigin wrote:
Just because you're anatomically male doesn't mean you can't be raped, abused, beaten, harassed, assaulted, or bullied.

And all of those are sadly more common for trans people, especially transwomen among men.


I was not aware. I guess I just assumed the risk would be about the same if they were physically the same.


They're not physically the same. Transwomen take estrogen hormones and while some may retain some former masculine muscle strength, it would be folly to assume they're just as strong or aggressive as a man. Transwomen and transmen should not be forced to be around cis men or women just because they were born with the same genitals. Particularly in an at-risk population like this, where marginalized by society and homeless, they are more likely dealing with depression, dysphoria, or other issues.

This is really not different from putting any other woman in the men's quarters.


Still have a lot to learn about this stuff! I apologize for my ignorance here.

On the topic of the elections,, it's kinda disheartening that, at this point, I don't feel like I'm really cheering for any candidates. There's no one that gets me excited, no one that I feel is a good choice to rally around. And maybe it's just that the nature of politicians as politicians has become more clear to me, maybe this is how politics always is and always will be and I'm just now noticing it; but I feel like I'm always just going to end up reluctantly choosing the decent-at-best democratic candidate because I'll hate the republican alternative.

There needs to be more movement, more push for reform, something big and exciting that will bring about change that I can get behind. And I'm just not feeling that anywhere. Maybe I'm just asking too much from politicians.

And yes, the two-party system needs to die; but that's not happening anytime soon.
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darkeningday
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Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 1:20 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 11:30 am 
 

l Lunaris l wrote:
There needs to be more movement, more push for reform, something big and exciting that will bring about change that I can get behind. And I'm just not feeling that anywhere. Maybe I'm just asking too much from politicians.

How the hell is that not Bernie Sanders?
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ambientsorrow wrote:
Pretty rubbish, I must say. Certainly not worth the hype behind it. Boring and predictable. A band for 14-22 year olds.

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Resident_Hazard
Possessed by Starscream's Ghost

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:33 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 12:41 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
l Lunaris l wrote:
There needs to be more movement, more push for reform, something big and exciting that will bring about change that I can get behind. And I'm just not feeling that anywhere. Maybe I'm just asking too much from politicians.

How the hell is that not Bernie Sanders?


I thought the same thing ha ha, that is definitely Bernie Sanders.
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henkkjelle
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:06 pm 
 

Smalley wrote:
Subrick wrote:
Buttchug's saying he won
Dude, grow up...

...if you're going to give Mayo Pete an insulting last name, use an actual clever one, like "Bootyjudge".

:-D


I wonder if using names like "bootyjudge" to refer to Pete would fly if it was being done by right wing conservatives. Of course it's a hundred times more likely that in that case there's actual malice behind it linked to Pete being gay, but you would still be condoning it by doing the same thing. Or at least you wouldn't be able to effectively criticise it if a Steven Crowder did it. I dunno maybe I'm overreacting here?

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Burnyoursins
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 2:22 pm 
 

I'm wiith you Henkk, however let's be honest, the conservative right is more likely to come up with a WAY worse nickname than "Bootyjudge".
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The_Beast_in_Black wrote:
SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
...no one still knows what it's supposed to be about.

Well, I reckon there's a pretty good chance it'll be about gory tits.

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Sedition and Pockets
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 8:29 am
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:11 pm 
 

l Lunaris l wrote:
Still have a lot to learn about this stuff! I apologize for my ignorance here.


It's my life and I still often feel like I know nothing. Every new day I find a new way to feel ignorant.

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severzhavnost
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:36 pm 
 

henkkjelle wrote:
I wonder if using names like "bootyjudge" to refer to Pete would fly if it was being done by right wing conservatives. Of course it's a hundred times more likely that in that case there's actual malice behind it linked to Pete being gay, but you would still be condoning it by doing the same thing. Or at least you wouldn't be able to effectively criticise it if a Steven Crowder did it. I dunno maybe I'm overreacting here?


Yes it would be nice if, when discussing important topics, everyone could be expected to display a rudimentary level of maturity. That said, for a candidate with ongoing problems around his whiteness and unpopularity among minorities, “Mayo Pete” is hilarious and on point :D
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PvtNinjer
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 6:18 pm 
 

Burnyoursins wrote:
I'm wiith you Henkk, however let's be honest, the conservative right is more likely to come up with a WAY worse nickname than "Bootyjudge".


Yeah a Crowder type would just call him a slur.

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Bingewolf
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Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:59 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 6:40 pm 
 

People being upset by the "buttchug" thing is the epitome of "snowflake lib" though and that is part of our problem. For someone to not know what buttchugging is and assume it's about Pete being gay - and then get mad and rally others - is an embarrassment. As a person who really cares a lot about inclusivity and human rights, I think stuff like that is really damaging to actual homophobia or racism that we have to combat. It's also what makes conservatives run with the whole "owning the libs" things - because, in this instance, they are right.

This is why it's important to draw a line between "PC culture" and what is actually bigotry...

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henkkjelle
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:00 pm 
 

I think it's as simple as not wanting to give the actual bigoted side an opening to use potentially dog-whistly stuff like that and being able to point at your side and say 'they're doing the same thing, it's just a joke" etc etc. I think it's a good thing to be aware of.

But yeah going on a public cancel crusade because someone said buttchug is dumb and an overreaction. It does more harm than good.

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Burnyoursins
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Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:59 am
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:03 pm 
 

Bingewolf wrote:
People being upset by the "buttchug" thing is the epitome of "snowflake lib" though and that is part of our problem. For someone to not know what buttchugging is and assume it's about Pete being gay - and then get mad and rally others - is an embarrassment. As a person who really cares a lot about inclusivity and human rights, I think stuff like that is really damaging to actual homophobia or racism that we have to combat. It's also what makes conservatives run with the whole "owning the libs" things - because, in this instance, they are right.

This is why it's important to draw a line between "PC culture" and what is actually bigotry...


Henkk is not American, and therefore probably DOESN'T know what "butt-chugging" is. All I'm saying is, coming up with dumbass nicknames for candidates you don't like isn't particularly funny, or clever, it's just sort of annoying. I'm not sitting here all offended because someone called a candidate "Buttchug". I certainly wouldn't assume it was a knock at his sexuality, and I can guarantee that what the conservative right calls Mayo Pete is a hell of a lot worse than "Buttchug". It's just sort of childish. It's like the whole introduction of the term "snowflake" in modern culture. A 7 year old on a playground could come up with a better insult than that, but it's so commonplace now it's like being on a playground full of 5 year old children throwing hissy-fits and calling each other stupid names that aren't even particularly offensive. I will say though, I do like "Mayo Pete" a lot. That IS clever.
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The_Beast_in_Black wrote:
SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
...no one still knows what it's supposed to be about.

Well, I reckon there's a pretty good chance it'll be about gory tits.

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henkkjelle
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:06 pm 
 

Burnyoursins wrote:

Henkk is not American, and therefore probably DOESN'T know what "butt-chugging" is


:lol: American culture has permeated through Europe far enough for us to know what butt-chugging is.

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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:14 pm 
 

I don't like Bootyjudge because it's not funny, but how the hell can it be construed as homophobic? Gay people have a monopoly on butt appreciation now? This type of selective, hair splitting outrage is what's wrong with liberals today. It's of the same crop as accusations of anti-semitism for saying Jewish lobbies use money to influence policy. Stop helping.
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Pretty rubbish, I must say. Certainly not worth the hype behind it. Boring and predictable. A band for 14-22 year olds.

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BastardHead
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:33 pm 
 

Newsflash: A candidate with "Butt" in his last name is going to have a nickname about butts. A candidate whose last name kinda sounds like "buttchug" is going to be called "buttchug". If you've got beef with his last name giving conservative trolls an opening to make butt jokes at him, take it up with his dad.
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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 1:18 am 
 

And now for something completely different: https://www.ibtimes.com/donald-trump-sp ... ir-2915455
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ambientsorrow wrote:
Pretty rubbish, I must say. Certainly not worth the hype behind it. Boring and predictable. A band for 14-22 year olds.

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insanewayne253
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 1:39 am 
 

Dementia with a possibility of mini strokes. The high stress of the job could doom him

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Zelkiiro
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:22 am 
 

insanewayne253 wrote:
The high stress of the job could doom him

Image
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:46 am 
 

Hopefully his brain melts and oozes out of his ears on national TV.
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Bingewolf
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:59 pm 
 

I mean, everyone who knows me from this forum knows that I will call out dog whistles and bigotry and that I don't tolerate it. However, "buttchug" is not a dog whistle. It is literally something that frat boys started doing to be zany at parties (putting beer in their butts to get drunk faster). So my only point is that we have to have some sense with things like that if we want to be taken serious when calling out actual bigotry...

And to Bastard's point, his name is "butt" - his nickname is going to have butt in it. We all learned this in kindergarten. :lol: (Actually, I think Mayo Pete is the homerun of the bunch...)

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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:33 pm 
 

Why is this story not getting the traction of Bernie's alleged "a woman can't win" remark? Maybe I'm still just salty for being called "fake woke" because I don't support a person who is the most stunning example of fake wokeness in this primary, but good god. If you still support Warren and consider yourself even the least bit socially conscious, reexamine exactly how you can sleep at night. This campaign uses the term Latinx yet treats its actual minority staffers like this:

Women of color bolt Warren’s Nevada campaign in frustration
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ambientsorrow wrote:
Pretty rubbish, I must say. Certainly not worth the hype behind it. Boring and predictable. A band for 14-22 year olds.

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Musick
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 5:52 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
Why is this story not getting the traction of Bernie's alleged "a woman can't win" remark?


For the same reason this story about Buttigieg is being ignored – the Dems are still anti-Bernie.

https://newsone.com/3901351/mayor-pete- ... -caucuses/

Listen, Im no Bernie supporter but its blatantly obvious he is getting screwed over consistently.
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henkkjelle
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:07 pm 
 

Bingewolf wrote:
I mean, everyone who knows me from this forum knows that I will call out dog whistles and bigotry and that I don't tolerate it. However, "buttchug" is not a dog whistle. It is literally something that frat boys started doing to be zany at parties (putting beer in their butts to get drunk faster). So my only point is that we have to have some sense with things like that if we want to be taken serious when calling out actual bigotry...

And to Bastard's point, his name is "butt" - his nickname is going to have butt in it. We all learned this in kindergarten. :lol: (Actually, I think Mayo Pete is the homerun of the bunch...)


This is a good point. And I should have been more specific; I don't think buttchug is a dog-whistle, but I think bootyjudge potentially could be. And if anything using it just plays into dumb Trump style politics. But eh, this is coming from a guy in a country with about a 1000% less political tension so maybe I'm just spoiled by civility.

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Sedition and Pockets
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 8:07 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
Why is this story not getting the traction of Bernie's alleged "a woman can't win" remark? Maybe I'm still just salty for being called "fake woke" because I don't support a person who is the most stunning example of fake wokeness in this primary, but good god. If you still support Warren and consider yourself even the least bit socially conscious, reexamine exactly how you can sleep at night. This campaign uses the term Latinx yet treats its actual minority staffers like this:

Women of color bolt Warren’s Nevada campaign in frustration


Warren's chances are cratering and attention is drifting elsewhere, tbh.

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