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DeadKid
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:51 am
Posts: 240
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2021 6:16 am 
 

I see also that Piers Corbyn spoke in support of Trump, so he's definitely in a weird place. Of course, when you argue with these people that the government control is the appropriate action to get the best outcome, every reputable scientific organisation and every news website they disagree with is automatically part of the conspiracy.

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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:48 pm 
 

That’s odd. In North America, the militant left has been very Covid-compliant. It’s pretty much exclusively the right-wing libertarians who cause trouble, not counting businesses here and there who skirt the rules for commercial rather than political reasons.
Also, not political but kind of amusing, I’ve come across reports of Mexican drug cartels taking it upon themselves to enforce the Covid rules.
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Slater922
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Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:24 pm
Posts: 413
PostPosted: Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:15 pm 
 

severzhavnost wrote:
Also, not political but kind of amusing, I’ve come across reports of Mexican drug cartels taking it upon themselves to enforce the Covid rules.

Geez, if drug cartels are having to enforce COVID-19 restrictions, then maybe the government should put more effort in enforcing the laws.
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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:59 pm 
 

Slater922 wrote:
severzhavnost wrote:
Also, not political but kind of amusing, I’ve come across reports of Mexican drug cartels taking it upon themselves to enforce the Covid rules.

Geez, if drug cartels are having to enforce COVID-19 restrictions, then maybe the government should put more effort in enforcing the laws.


Well we shouldn’t poke at the Mexicans too much. They’re almost keeping pace with Canada’s bumbling vaccination program.
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Malbordus
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 9:46 am
Posts: 138
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 4:53 pm 
 

The left definitely have plenty of loony to go round also, even regarding vaccines. There's a large overlap between left and "alternative" medicine, mistrust of big pharma. As an example my dad is a homeopath and won't vaccinate and sure enough Covid recently raged through the extended family although ultimately no harm done. I've had all the arguments, it's a waste of effort and one day they'll get something serious then drop their principle like a sack of shit.

See also the link between yoga and anti-vax e.g.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/yoga-disinformation-qanon-conspiracy-wellness

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Methuen
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2021 5:13 pm 
 

Something positive to come out of travel restrictions for COVID; it's helping to put the final nail into private rail in the UK - if they can't profit, they get out, and with no passengers, they can't profit. Missed the original publication of this in November, but hopefully it's the start of a trend.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-54635421

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Hexenmacht46290
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:30 pm
Posts: 76
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2021 5:39 pm 
 

I used to work with someone, who was a yoga instructor, and was into some really insane conspiracy shit. He never was telling people not to get vaccinated, but he was giving some dubious medical advice. People were willing to take his word, because yoga is “healthy,” and he was charismatic. He was university educated, and could speak well, and could impress uneducated people with obscure knowledge, so, a winning combination, to ensure credibility among the credulous.

Charisma doesn’t work on me, and I and he had some philosophical debates, while working together. I eventually got him to admit, that he wasn’t Hindu, and that his philosophy was actually just the “just world” view of “the secret.” He claimed that “linear time,” and objective reality weren’t actually real. He knew I wasn’t buying his shit, and we got along, so mostly he just told me about the conspiracy stuff for entertainment, and I laughed at it.

But then I found out, that the bison dumbass, from the riot, had a YouTube channel, where he talked about how he was doing occult battle with evil alien forces(http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/revie ... ock-part-1 this is the conspiracy universe that he believes in. It has reptilian shapeshifters, but isn’t David Icke, it’s its own lame sci-fi universe). It was the same dumb shit, that the yoga dude I worked with was into, and like him, the rioter was also a yoga instructor!

I used to watch videos and read internet stuff, back in the 2000s, and just laugh at it. But it’s pretty disturbing, that so much of the world can’t separate fact from fiction. I’m capable of watching X-files, and reading H.P. Lovecraft and Clark Ashton Smith, and knowing it’s not real. But all of these conspiracy theories just rip off each other, and old media, and people don’t realize it.

Pretty sad, to know that people around me, who would claim to be totally reasonable, and not in support of authoritarian coups, are asskissing enablers.

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Osore
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:55 am
Posts: 450
Location: Serbia
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:05 am 
 

For the people who can choose between different types of vaccines

First I would like to stress that any vaccine that can be chosen from a list in Serbia (Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Sputnik V, Sinopharm) is better than not getting vaccinated at all. The problem in scientific community is that Russians and Chinese are hiding data from the 3rd phase of clinical trials, which makes it more difficult to recommend these vaccines. (Phase 3 for Sinopharm is currently undergoing in Serbia - if you get this vaccine, you are among the people who are being monitored for side effects and effectiveness of the vaccine). By the way, phase 3 testing is done on a larger population sample (as oppose to phase 1 and 2), which increases the likelihood of getting statistically more significant data.

Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca have published relevant data in peer-reviewed scientific journals.

WHO provides a frequently updated link with status of vaccines here: https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/covid-19-vaccines. Newest update says WHO approves only Pfizer and Moderna: https://extranet.who.int/pqweb/sites/default/files/documents/Status_COVID_VAX_16Feb2021.pdf, as of February the 16th.

From a mechanistic viewpoint, Sinopharm made the vaccine using classic method, Sputnik V and AstraZeneca are based on a newer technology, and Pfizer and Moderna use the newest method based on RNA. If you are allergic to PEG (polyethylene glycol, alcohol found in many cosmetic products like cremes), don't take Pfizer. I have studied all these methods only in theory on my bachelor studies and they are complicated/draining, albeit understandable and easy to forget. If you insist, I can explain these to you quickly or you can find simple explanations online. What I would like to know are step-by-step details (protocols) and how it looks in practise. I might get plagued with transfection method in the future (not for the purpose of making vaccines), so let's not summon those demons.

Having all of this in mind, I have ticked Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca because I have data and I know every single component of these vaccines (data sheets can be found online), so if I get allergic reaction, at least I will know what I have inside of me. My grandfather had chosen the other two and got the call to get Sinopharm's vaccine, which is the only one available in our municipality. He received the second those on Friday last week and has no side-effects.

Also, if you want Pfizer, beware, they must not shake the content, it is clearly written in the instructions. RNA molecules are packed in nano-lipid vesicles and by shaking, they can be disturbed. ''Stripped'' RNAs cannot enter into your cells. I've heard that technicians shake them like classic vaccines.
I expect the call for the vaccination in a matter of days; I missed the previous one last week because someone at the institute didn't check mail box on time (not to mention they had to beg the authorities to prioritise/approve the vaccination of researchers and scientists and give us appointments). 40000 Pfizer vaccine have arrived in the country and this is the one I am going to ask for first.

I'll be back, hopefully with zero side-effects.

Be responsible, take the shot and share your story.
(・_・)ノ

Update:
Sputnik V phase 3 clinical trial data
Spoiler: show
Quote:
Our interim results of the phase 3 Gam-COVID-Vac trial show that the vaccine is 91·6% (95% CI 85·6–95·2) efficacious against COVID 19 (from day 21 after first dose, the day of receiving second dose).

Sputnik V COVID-19 vaccine candidate appears safe and effective


Last edited by Osore on Sat Feb 20, 2021 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wahn_nhaW
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:34 pm
Posts: 140
Location: Belgrade, Serbia
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:14 am 
 

Osore wrote:
For the people who can choose between different types of vaccines

First I would like to stress that any vaccine that can be chosen from a list in Serbia (Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Sputnik V, Sinopharm) is better than not getting vaccinated at all. The problem in scientific community is that Russians and Chinese are hiding data from the 3rd phase of clinical trials, which makes it more difficult to recommend these vaccines. (Phase 3 for Sinopharm is currently undergoing in Serbia - if you get this vaccine, you are among the people who are being monitored for side effects and effectiveness of the vaccine). By the way, phase 3 testing is done on a larger population sample (as oppose to phase 1 and 2), which increases the likelihood of getting statistically more significant data.

Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca have published relevant data in peer-reviewed scientific journals.

WHO provides a frequently updated link with status of vaccines here: https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/covid-19-vaccines. Newest update says WHO approves only Pfizer and Moderna: https://extranet.who.int/pqweb/sites/default/files/documents/Status_COVID_VAX_16Feb2021.pdf, as of February the 16th.

From a mechanistic viewpoint, Sinopharm made the vaccine using classic method, Sputnik V and AstraZeneca are based on a newer technology, and Pfizer and Moderna use the newest method based on RNA. If you are allergic to PEG (polyethylene glycol, alcohol found in many cosmetic products like cremes), don't take Pfizer. I have studied all these methods only in theory on my bachelor studies and they are complicated/draining, albeit understandable and easy to forget. If you insist, I can explain these to you quickly or you can find simple explanations online. What I would like to know are step-by-step details (protocols) and how it looks in practise. I might get plagued with transfection method in the future (not for the purpose of making vaccines), so let's not summon those demons.

Having all of this in mind, I have ticked Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca because I have data and I know every single component of these vaccines (data sheets can be found online), so if I get allergic reaction, at least I will know what I have inside of me. My grandfather had chosen the other two and got the call to get Sinopharm's vaccine, which is the only one available in our municipality. He received the second those on Friday last week and has no side-effects.

Also, if you want Pfizer, beware, they must not shake the content, it is clearly written in the instructions. RNA molecules are packed in nano-lipid vesicles and by shaking, they can be disturbed. ''Stripped'' RNAs cannot enter into your cells. I've heard that technicians shake them like classic vaccines.
I expect the call for the vaccination in a matter of days; I missed the previous one last week because someone at the institute didn't check mail box on time (not to mention they had to beg the authorities to prioritise/approve the vaccination of researchers and scientists and give us appointments). 40000 Pfizer vaccine have arrived in the country and this is the one I am going to ask for first.

I'll be back, hopefully with zero side-effects.

Be responsible, take the shot and share your story.
(・_・)ノ


Thanks for the info. I applied a month ago and chose the exact three you did (and unchecked the Russian and the Chinese ones for pretty much the same reasons you cite). Still waiting for the call, of course. :D
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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:55 pm 
 

I really hope the Sputnik vaccine is good, because it’s being deployed in Gaza right now, while Israel has kept the more widely-trusted Pfizer and Moderna vaccines for themselves. Okay, the Pfizer has weird storage requirements that are probably beyond the technical capacity of the wartorn Gaza Strip, but... if it turns out there’s something wrong with the hastily-developed Russian vac dumped on the Gazans and the Israelis are doing fine with the “good Western ones”, that would be absolutely monstrous.
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megalowho
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:33 am
Posts: 613
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:34 pm 
 

Osore wrote:
Be responsible, take the shot and share your story.
(・_・)ノ


I ended up with Moderna. The first shot was fine, and the second one (four weeks between shots) had some side-effects. Nothing too bad, just fatigue for a day or so...I napped it off. :)

I heard this is not uncommon for the second one in particular. Other people reported some chills and aches.

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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2021 4:30 pm 
 

British NHS offers healthy man a Covid vaccine, due to records mistakenly listing him as astronomically obese:
https://www.buzz.ie/amp/news/man-offere ... all-418560

:lol: Seems his height had been documented as 6.2cm instead of 6ft 2, so his BMI worked out to an impossible 28,000. Getting on the phone to explain “I’m not obese!” and decline the vaccine, must have been a fun experience.
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Methuen
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:58 pm 
 

severzhavnost wrote:
British NHS offers healthy man a Covid vaccine, due to records mistakenly listing him as astronomically obese:
https://www.buzz.ie/amp/news/man-offere ... all-418560

:lol: Seems his height had been documented as 6.2cm instead of 6ft 2, so his BMI worked out to an impossible 28,000. Getting on the phone to explain “I’m not obese!” and decline the vaccine, must have been a fun experience.


That's brilliant :lol: I love that the error made its way all the way to 'you're invited...' before anyone thought about it.

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Osore
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:55 am
Posts: 450
Location: Serbia
PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2021 1:51 pm 
 

severzhavnost wrote:
I really hope the Sputnik vaccine is good.
It is, see the update at the end of my post above: https://forum.metal-archives.com/viewtopic.php?p=2959578#p2959578. ;) I have just changed my application to include it.

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Osore
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:55 am
Posts: 450
Location: Serbia
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:03 am 
 

Osore wrote:
I'll be back, hopefully with zero side-effects.
Indeed. I got Sinopharm's vaccine yesterday, which I haven't signed up for - they didn't have any other, and I'm talkin about the Institute of Public Health of Serbia. :ah-ha:
Well, something is better than nothing. I'm also glad I'll take the second dose in three weeks, just before my pollen allergy goes wild.
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Methuen
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Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:57 am 
 

As predicted by many across all of the political spectrum, there are now plans afoot to force 'Vaccine ID' on people - It seems to be Boris's plan, and Tony Blair is of course in favour, so are (with reservations) Trade Unions and the SNP; with conservative MPs and various human rights think-tanks opposing outright.

The plan is for people to carry their status on their phone, and use that to access (or not) various services / locations depending on status. Pretty sure I've seen that movie ?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/24/four-key-questions-on-a-covid-certification-scheme-in-england

This was first published (and laughed at) in December, captain hindsight is a cruel master !

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/revealed-the-uk-s-covid-passport-plan

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Osore
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:55 am
Posts: 450
Location: Serbia
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:10 pm 
 

٩(ఠ益ఠ)۶ I have just received an SMS and e-mail informing me to get vaccinated on Saturday in my municipality, based on online application I made. :eek: It means they officially reached a category of healthy 27 year old people. If I knew it would be so quick, I would have waited for Pfizer. I'm tempted to go and get another shot, but I don't want to experiment with such cocktails and steel someone's vaccine.

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Gravetemplar
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:08 am
Posts: 2150
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:50 pm 
 

Osore wrote:
٩(ఠ益ఠ)۶ I have just received an SMS and e-mail informing me to get vaccinated on Saturday in my municipality, based on online application I made. :eek: It means they officially reached a category of healthy 27 year old people. If I knew it would be so quick, I would have waited for Pfizer. I'm tempted to go and get another shot, but I don't want to experiment with such cocktails and steel someone's vaccine.

That's crazy. They are still vaccinating +90 people here and it's a complete disaster...

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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:01 pm 
 

Methuen wrote:
As predicted by many across all of the political spectrum, there are now plans afoot to force 'Vaccine ID' on people - It seems to be Boris's plan, and Tony Blair is of course in favour, so are (with reservations) Trade Unions and the SNP; with conservative MPs and various human rights think-tanks opposing outright.

The plan is for people to carry their status on their phone, and use that to access (or not) various services / locations depending on status. Pretty sure I've seen that movie ?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/24/four-key-questions-on-a-covid-certification-scheme-in-england

This was first published (and laughed at) in December, captain hindsight is a cruel master !

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/revealed-the-uk-s-covid-passport-plan


Britain has gotten off to quite a racing start on vaccination, so this Covid passport idea might not be entirely disastrous for businesses who are told to enforce it. If this idea comes to Canada, with our bum-stumbling pace of vaccination, there would be absolutely no point in opening anything at all. There would be nowhere near enough allowable customers to make it worthwhile.
In general, I don’t mind the vaxport for travel, but that’s pretty much it. I’ll be goddamn buggered if I’m trapped at home again, just because I have not gotten a vaccine that I would happily get, except that the useless government literally can’t procure a vaccine to save its life.
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Methuen
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:57 pm 
 

Yeah, I can see it's not a bad idea, I'm just extremely cynical about the motivation behind it :lol: Has Canada tried to inflict ID cards on people in the recent past ? Various governments here have tried it on - Blair's lot tried to use 9/11 for it, Cameron & May both tried it on using migration as an excuse, and Boris now has COVID.

Did Canada get stuffed because of ' we don't have the production facilities - syndrome ? Britain should really have been hit by that, except Boris in an un-characteristic fit of efficiency threw piles of money at the pharma companies ahead of just about anyone else.

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Invocation
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:11 pm
Posts: 51
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:26 pm 
 

Methuen wrote:
Did Canada get stuffed because of ' we don't have the production facilities - syndrome ? Britain should really have been hit by that, except Boris* in an un-characteristic fit of efficiency threw piles of money at the pharma companies ahead of just about anyone else.


*Matt Hancock.

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Methuen
Metalhead

Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:36 pm 
 

Invocation wrote:
Methuen wrote:
Did Canada get stuffed because of ' we don't have the production facilities - syndrome ? Britain should really have been hit by that, except Boris* in an un-characteristic fit of efficiency threw piles of money at the pharma companies ahead of just about anyone else.


*Matt Hancock.

I wish I'd had a tenner on him doing something useful, then :lol:

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severzhavnost
Something Stupid

Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 pm
Posts: 2880
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:26 pm 
 

Methuen wrote:
Yeah, I can see it's not a bad idea, I'm just extremely cynical about the motivation behind it :lol: Has Canada tried to inflict ID cards on people in the recent past ? Various governments here have tried it on - Blair's lot tried to use 9/11 for it, Cameron & May both tried it on using migration as an excuse, and Boris now has COVID.

Did Canada get stuffed because of ' we don't have the production facilities - syndrome ? Britain should really have been hit by that, except Boris in an un-characteristic fit of efficiency threw piles of money at the pharma companies ahead of just about anyone else.


That’s the problem exactly. Canada doesn’t manufacture shit all. In defence of PM Trudope, this problem long predicts his regime, so it’s not his fault. But he has been astoundingly slow to address it.
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Methuen
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Joined: Tue May 19, 2015 4:55 pm
Posts: 1460
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:19 am 
 

The differences in co-operation and decent behaviour are quite stark - see two examples of how COVID-vaccination is being approached - it's shame that a properly global approach can't be organised (via the UN or whatever), and instead we've got private initiatives working alongside state-sponsored disruption activities.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2021/mar/01/coronavirus-live-news-vaccine-acceptance-rising-in-uk-us-and-france-south-africa-eases-restrictions#block-603cc59e8f08be9d080d7956

Quote:
People began to queue early as the Ivory Coast prepared to become the first country to launch a Covid-19 inoculation drive on Monday with doses from the Covax vaccine sharing facility.

Ivory Coast received 504,000 doses of the AstraZeneca/Oxford vaccine on Friday, and plans to roll it out to medical workers, security forces members and teachers before vaccinating people over 50, those with chronic diseases and travellers.

More than a hundred people were lining up early on Monday at a sports complex in the Treichville neighbourhood of Ivory Coast’s commercial capital Abidjan to receive their first shot, Reuters reported.

Covax, which is led by the GAVI vaccines alliance along with the World Health Organization (WHO) and other partners, is meant to ensure fairer distribution. It aims to deliver nearly 2bn doses to over 90 low- and middle-income countries, covering up to 20% of their populations.

The initiative hopes to level a playing field that has seen wealthier nations vaccinate millions while comparatively few have received shots in poorer parts of the world. Only a handful of African countries have begun inoculating their citizens with vaccines purchased bilaterally or received as donations.

Africa has reported relatively few Covid-19 deaths compared to other continents, but the death toll is rising fast as a second wave of infections overwhelms hospitals.

Ivory Coast’s neighbour Ghana, which last week became the first country to receive a delivery of vaccines from Covax, plans to officially begin its vaccination campaign on Tuesday.


Quote:
Chinese state-backed hackers target Indian vaccine makers, cyberintelligence firm says

A Chinese state-backed hacking group has in recent weeks targeted the IT systems of two Indian vaccine makers whose coronavirus shots are being used in the country’s immunisation campaign, cyber intelligence firm Cyfirma told Reuters.

Rivals China and India have both sold or gifted COVID-19 shots to many countries. India produces more than 60% of all vaccines sold in the world.

Goldman Sachs-backed Cyfirma, based in Singapore and Tokyo, said Chinese hacking group APT10, also known as Stone Panda, had identified gaps and vulnerabilities in the IT infrastructure and supply chain software of Bharat Biotech and the Serum Institute of India (SII), the world’s largest vaccine maker.

“The real motivation here is actually exfiltrating intellectual property and getting competitive advantage over Indian pharmaceutical companies,” said Cyfirma Chief Executive Kumar Ritesh, formerly a top cyber official with British foreign intelligence agency MI6.

He said APT10 was actively targeting SII, which is making the AstraZeneca vaccine for many countries and will soon start bulk-manufacturing Novavax shots.

“In the case of Serum Institute, they have found a number of their public servers running weak web servers, these are vulnerable web servers,” Ritesh said, referring to the hackers. “They have spoken about weak web application, they are also talking about weak content-management system. It’s quite alarming.”

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