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Sepulchrave
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:29 pm
Posts: 1658
Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:41 am 
 

So my band independently released an album on bandcamp a few days ago. It's not a serious project. Recently I got an e-mail from some guy from Kazakhstan. Asked if I wanted CDs made and distributed by his label. Should I be wary? Have no experience with this kind of thing.

It looks quite legit: https://narcolepticaprod.bandcamp.com/music

EDIT: The guy offered 210 euro to make 150 CDs, 50 of which he would distribute himself. I think I should see the CDs first.
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Jabawock
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 8:31 pm
Posts: 107
Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:10 am 
 

I have never heard of this label nor any of the numerous bands he has released, but the website appears legit and he's been seemingly active for a number of years.

When looking at the deal he offers you, it seems too good to be true : basically he would pay you 210€, AND send you 100 free CDs, just to keep 50 for himself?! Unless he has a very very cheap way of producing these CDs, there's almost no way he can make any kind of profit on this deal....

But anyway, I think you can just agree as long as he pays in advance. There is basically no risk for you. If you get the payment, let him press the CDs. And even if you end up not getting any CDs from him, you still got the money :)

Just don't give him the copyright for your music. If he asks you to sign a contract, make sure it is an (exclusive) license to press CDs, and nothing more
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Element_man
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:37 am
Posts: 928
Location: Vancouver, Canada
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:50 pm 
 

Jabawock wrote:
When looking at the deal he offers you, it seems too good to be true : basically he would pay you 210€, AND send you 100 free CDs, just to keep 50 for himself?! Unless he has a very very cheap way of producing these CDs, there's almost no way he can make any kind of profit on this deal....

I wonder if this is a language-barrier thing. Like the label guy is telling you how much it'll cost to make the CDs? Even if that were true, he would need to sell each of his 50 copies at 4,2 euro in order to break even on the pressing. That's a tough number. Either the CDs+printing will super cheap or there's some sort of misunderstanding here.

Quote:
Just don't give him the copyright for your music. If he asks you to sign a contract, make sure it is an (exclusive) license to press CDs, and nothing more
This is 100% good advice. And don't be afraid to ask this guy questions if anything is unclear.

If things get more weird and you get a bad feeling in your gut, then I would back out. There are plenty of small labels who can press and distribute your music, I promise.
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Sepulchrave
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:29 pm
Posts: 1658
Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:33 pm 
 

Sorry, my edit was not written correctly, Element_man is right, except that the language barrier lies with me :-P . The guy said that if WE paid HIM 210 euros then he will print CDs and send 100 of them to us and that he will keep the other 50.

Anyway, the band decided that it would be better to ask someone local about CDs and distribution rather than some guy in Kazakhstan (not everyone is willing to chip in), but I might reconsider.
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Jabawock
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 8:31 pm
Posts: 107
Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:07 am 
 

Sepulchrave wrote:
Sorry, my edit was not written correctly, Element_man is right, except that the language barrier lies with me :-P . The guy said that if WE paid HIM 210 euros then he will print CDs and send 100 of them to us and that he will keep the other 50.


Ok, I had a feeling this might be what he intended...
In this case, it's a pretty bad deal and you should definitely not go through with it. A honest label is not going to ask YOU money to press your CDs : a more common deal would be for the label to take care of all pressing costs, and send you a portion of the CDs produced for free (typically 10-20%) as a form of royalties payment.

Good luck!
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aloof
avant-gardener

Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:18 pm
Posts: 2155
Location: never neverland, palm trees by the sea
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:31 am 
 

Jabawock wrote:
A honest label is not going to ask YOU money to press your CDs : a more common deal would be for the label to take care of all pressing costs, and send you a portion of the CDs produced for free (typically 10-20%) as a form of royalties payment.


the times are a-changing... and that's no longer the case. you can dispute the "honest" bit if you want, but there's plenty legit labels right now who do exactly that: pressing the CD on your own costs let's say £500, they ask you for £600 and they take care of the pressing plant business for you (a lot can go wrong there for young bands -and not so young, see Lord Vicar :D), plus it comes out on a label, etc.

sometimes they also "promise" promo work, which is usually either minimal or doesn't materialize at all, making them not so "honest", I guess, but I know a lot of bands who have agreed to/fallen for it.

there's still labels who offer bands the deal you describe, obvs, but I figure they're in the offing :/
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CheCoola
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 2:37 pm
Posts: 7
Location: Kazakhstan
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:55 pm 
 

On the label there is a metal band from Croatia. Regression Of Style and Exterior Palnet. I think you can ask them.

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Shargazar
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:57 pm
Posts: 1
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 4:56 am 
 

... Got asked by him a few weeks ago if we want him to make promo CD versions of our demo tape (which was intended to STAY on tape). We first agreed but then he decided that he would prefer to make actual CDs out of it after we sent him the files. We didn't reply anymore because we also weren't clear anymore about wanting that or not, as the intention of the tape was to actually stay a tape release ...

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Zodijackyl
63 Axe Handles High

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 7431
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:10 am 
 

210 Euros would be better spent making a small run of CDs yourself. You can get 100 CDs made by Kunaki for $150. There's nothing wrong with what this label is doing, but realize this is exactly the same thing they're doing to the other 250+ bands on the label. They're having you pay for the costs of pressing CDs, then keeping some on hand to sell (along with digital downloads) for extra money.

As you said, it's not a serious band. Do you think a label is going to treat it as any more than that, or are they going to take your money, throw the album on their own BandCamp, and shelve the copies unless you promote it enough for someone to buy it from them?

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CheCoola
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 2:37 pm
Posts: 7
Location: Kazakhstan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:11 pm 
 

To talk about something with confidence, you must at least know it. :)
I suggest teams to make the replicated CDs (not CDR!) with offset printing of booklets. The cost of 150 copies is 255 euros. I suggest that the musicians invest 170 euros for 100 copies, and I pay for the production of 50 of them myself and keep them for myself. The group also pays for the delivery of the insured parcel to its country, and this cost is 40 euros. It turns out that the group can make 100 professional CDs for 210 euros. This is better than paying 400 euros for 300 copies, which the underground group will not be able to sell in 10 years.
Also there is no influence on copyrights and on Bandcamp tracks are loaded only at the request of musicians. If you look closely, you will notice that many albums do not have sales of digital versions.
My label has long developed its activities and thus helps to make branded CDs for young underground bands at a lower cost.
Proposal about KUNAKI interesting, but only there you will make ordinary CDR. These CDRs will be of good quality, but no self-respecting label or store will ever take a CDR for distribution.

As for releasing the album on their own money and giving the band 10-20% of the circulation as royalties, this is of course the most common option. But... No one will release a little-known underground band in this way. Everyone is saying that it is necessary to do so, but nobody does it, heh heh

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Bronan
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 24, 2014 4:10 pm
Posts: 34
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:59 pm 
 

aloof wrote:
Jabawock wrote:
A honest label is not going to ask YOU money to press your CDs : a more common deal would be for the label to take care of all pressing costs, and send you a portion of the CDs produced for free (typically 10-20%) as a form of royalties payment.


the times are a-changing... and that's no longer the case. you can dispute the "honest" bit if you want, but there's plenty legit labels right now who do exactly that: pressing the CD on your own costs let's say £500, they ask you for £600 and they take care of the pressing plant business for you (a lot can go wrong there for young bands -and not so young, see Lord Vicar :D), plus it comes out on a label, etc.

sometimes they also "promise" promo work, which is usually either minimal or doesn't materialize at all, making them not so "honest", I guess, but I know a lot of bands who have agreed to/fallen for it.

there's still labels who offer bands the deal you describe, obvs, but I figure they're in the offing :/


I got the same offer here but shot it down and didn't get past the intro. It's like live venues, never play for a venue that makes you sell your own tickets.

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