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Gameofmetal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 5:57 pm
Posts: 28
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:33 am 
 

Can also extend this question somewhat to cavernous black or death metal stuff. I find that there's a lot of easy resources for making super generic stereotypical black metal or more mainstream metal production, but resources for stuff in between or maybe outside those areas are fewer. Like Diocletian for example, I really like the production on Gesundrian, but I find it challenging to imitate the sound of records like that in both guitar tone and the general mix.

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GrotesqueCarcass
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:49 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:48 am 
 

Well, Gesundrian strays a bit too far from war or black/death metal production. It has a lot more in common with death metal than with Diocletian's previous work.

For black/death I wouldn't worry too much about what amp or pickups you use, since it's usually so distorted and sludgy that you're pretty much good with anything that's high gain and has a pretty saturated gain structure, like a 5150 or a Recto. Don't boost your amps, 'cause you won't be looking for a tight guitar sound, it's basically the complete opposite. If you have something like a RAT to boost those types of amps, all the better.
Speakers and mics can be whatever you want, just make sure you get a sound that works with your drums and isn't too bright.

In terms of mixing, use lots of saturation, focus on carving mid range to make space for every instrument without boosting the high end since you want it cavernous and dark, and make sure you use a healthy amount of reverb but never use presets that are too bright. Make sure to use a good amout of compression on drums to make them pounding and consistent, and it will help if they're tuned low to get that Revenge-esque tone.

You should know that you'll never be able to copy an album's sound and come out with an exact 1:1 replica. It's just impossible to do since you don't have the same gear, mics, consoles, monitoring situation, etc.
Just make sure you use the records that you like as a blueprint and a guide, but sculpt your tones to bring out what your instruments sound like, not to make them sound more like your favorite record. Make the tones your own.

Hope this helps, and please don't hesitate to ask anything.
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HviteGuden
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:24 am
Posts: 188
Location: Russia
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:55 am 
 

Gameofmetal wrote:
Can also extend this question somewhat to cavernous black or death metal stuff.

Well, cavernous black/death metal isn't based on lo-fi stuff to the same extent war metal is. It's not about straightforward aggression in contrast to war metal. It's more complex and chaotic, it focuses on darker atmosphere, other than on pounding nature of a music. Cavernous black/death sounds like Necros Christos or Grave Miasma. War metal sounds like Archgoat or the mentioned Diocletian. Usually a difference is pretty clear. However, there can be bands, which are somewhere inbetween, like Teitanblood.

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VigilantRabbit
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2016 3:02 pm
Posts: 21
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:15 am 
 

Couple of things I'll add in conjunction to the points already made:
- What recording style are you utilizing/ considering? If you're going for more "wall of noise" yet cavernous, i suggest mic'ing your amplifiers instead of DI, gives it that element depending on the amp settings, type of mic used, and variables with recording program (including Hertz rate, which can variably make it sound more live or more condensed apart from what may get filtered out). When you mic the amp and up the bass and mid while keeping the treble at or below 75%, it'll add some serious wall and punch to the sound.
In conjunction to that as well, the mic'ing instead of DI will help eliminate the tedious time it takes toying with digital patches and whatnot that will inevitably eat up file space both in program implementation and in file format export. On the flipside of that, there's so many augmentations and variation you can utilize with a myriad of programs out there, so really it just takes time to tinker with stuff and figure out what sounds good to you apart from how you compress things and the like.
- What kind of drum element are you going for? More pronounced/ intelligible or way down in the mix? Things to consider (cymbal level compared to kick and snare can dynamically change how it sounds) apart from the tuning/ key you want the drums in-- for some projects the super tight skin snare (almost a piccolo snare) works great, others you want to tune the skins to C or possibly lower, just depends on what you like tonally. Same goes for vocals and the mix.
- Use lots of reverb (40 to 60% is a good starting point on amplifiers straight up, will vary with model).

Overall, just consider toying around, take notes on settings you like, and go from there til you get to something you're happy with.

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Gameofmetal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2019 5:57 pm
Posts: 28
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:12 pm 
 

Appreciate the answers.

Actually figured out a lot of this on my own since I made this post like five months ago and have been working on some war metal styled stuff lately that's coming out pretty good. Still going DI for now but scooping a high gain amp with cuts to presence and loads of gain have done the trick so far. Ample amounts of a darker reverb. Never messed with saturation much but just got an analog saturation unit from Nembrini and threw it on a track and it was kind of eye opening.

Drums wise I'm using Kvlt Drums 2. At this point I have a decent enough idea of writing them from a drummer perspective without being one and applying fx myself so they sound good to me. The whole drum tuning thing has always been a mystery to me, can you explain that a bit? I know they can be tuned, just never been sure how important it is for a midi kit or if you need to match them to the guitars or what.

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