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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 11196
Location: Ob der Enns, Austria
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 8:02 am 
 

Shadechaser wrote:
https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Heruka/3540458120
one track is metal, one is ambient.

It's an annoying case, but still I'm inclined to keep it. The metal track is longer and also unambiguously metal.

Witcher wrote:
Release (USA): Even if it features former members of Anvil Chorus and Sacrilege B.C., that sound here is not thrash or heavy metal, but rather a mixture of nu-metal/alalternative rock and grunge, which is similar to bands like Mushroonhead or Tool:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9G0gx27 ... 48Q81Xg_PI

Deleted.

Shadechaser wrote:
got it, thx...
though... actually I think things change sometimes not accordingly to the rules set by Metal Archives.
in particular, there's not such release now, but it's listed here.

Regardless, the release existed at some point as an official, public download. It stands to reason that it "got out there" in certain quantities and thus persists to this day. Even if we were absolutely certain that everyone who downloaded it wiped their hard drives and extinguished every last trace of it, it still wouldn't change the fact that the release happened. I know digital releases muddy these waters, but this still falls within our area of responsibility of documenting how things transpired. If someone were to destroy every last copy of an obscure tape release from the 80s, should we then delete the entry from MA?

Shadechaser wrote:
I think that the band and it's member(s) are the one and only who should decide the destiny for their releases, don't you think so?

Not if it means compromising the veracity of the data and revising their own history. In an ideal world we'd give bands total control over their respective pages, since they should be able to provide the most accurate and complete information. But far too often there is simply a conflict of interest between providing an objective account for posterity and how one wants to present (or hide) their own work to (from) the world.
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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 2:21 pm 
 

Witcher wrote:
World Hate Center (Ger): I have noticed, that there was already some dispute about the band's style in 2011, but back then , only two songs from the album wre provided. Hre is the complete album Reloaded and I think, that the style of the band is really predominantly a mix of rac and hatecore, as the download description says and onot thrash metal or predominantly metal for that matter:
https://www.rac-forum.org/forum/showthread.php?t=255

Thanks and here is another repost from the previous page.
http://88nsm.com/975-world-hate-center- ... -2005.html


Last edited by Witcher on Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Shadechaser
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:06 am
Posts: 211
Location: Russia
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 8:58 am 
 

Azmodes wrote:
Shadechaser wrote:
https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Heruka/3540458120
one track is metal, one is ambient.

It's an annoying case, but still I'm inclined to keep it. The metal track is longer and also unambiguously metal.

according to this, what minimum length should be the metal part of the only band's release to be accepted on MA?
let's consider the band issued physical releases via a label, like in this case.

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 11196
Location: Ob der Enns, Austria
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:09 am 
 

Well, the rule of thumb is unsurprisingly "more metal than not". I can't really give you any definitive numbers; these borderliners are very much case-by-case and there can be other factors to consider. Anything I could tell you now might not be 100% decisive for something else. You'll just have to accept that when you're in highly fuzzy territory like this, there's gonna be judgement calls and the submission might not always make it.
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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:09 am 
 

Azazel are actually imo one of the more metal based metalcore bands out there, their music has hearable death and black metal influences, no alternative/emo parts with clean singing and their style is overall comparable to the second Underoath album. Are you really sure, what you are exactly doing there, Tsstealthp?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNzCyoXb86w

Edit: On the other hand a band like Children Of Gaia is really "core galore" type of band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWTvxuxqxls
Take this as a friendly advice, but maybe you should try to briefly explain in your posts, why do you think the band is not metal, using some style related arguments,. I am sure , it would help the mods andallow you to narrow down your list of bands. The same for your post on the previous page, it is useless to post bands, for which you are convinced, that they have at least one acceptable ep. You can select the two really problematic bands from your list and repost it here.


Last edited by Witcher on Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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~Guest 318854
Rare Earth Metal

Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:16 pm
Posts: 915
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:44 am 
 

Witcher wrote:
Azazel are actually imo one of the more metal based metalcore bands out there, their music has hearable death and black metal influences, no alternative/emo parts with clean singing and their style is overall comparable to the second Underoath album. Are you really sure, what you are exactly doing there, Tsstealthp?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNzCyoXb86w


Best regards, I refer to this Azazel:

https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Azazel/130009

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TheGrimWombat
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:06 am
Posts: 2138
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:45 am 
 

ThStealthP wrote:
Witcher wrote:
Azazel are actually imo one of the more metal based metalcore bands out there, their music has hearable death and black metal influences, no alternative/emo parts with clean singing and their style is overall comparable to the second Underoath album. Are you really sure, what you are exactly doing there, Tsstealthp?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNzCyoXb86w


Best regards, I refer to this Azazel:

https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Azazel/130009


That's the one he linked, genius.

Edit:

I was unaware that Amora Savant was here, or forgot it was. Yeah, that should definitely be deleted.
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~Guest 318854
Rare Earth Metal

Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:16 pm
Posts: 915
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:00 am 
 

TheGrimWombat wrote:
ThStealthP wrote:
Witcher wrote:
Azazel are actually imo one of the more metal based metalcore bands out there, their music has hearable death and black metal influences, no alternative/emo parts with clean singing and their style is overall comparable to the second Underoath album. Are you really sure, what you are exactly doing there, Tsstealthp?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNzCyoXb86w


Best regards, I refer to this Azazel:

https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Azazel/130009


That's the one he linked, genius.


I didn't notice that it was the same. I found their second release a few minutes, at first I could only find their first release.

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~Guest 318854
Rare Earth Metal

Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:16 pm
Posts: 915
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:20 am 
 

Witcher wrote:
Azazel are actually imo one of the more metal based metalcore bands out there, their music has hearable death and black metal influences, no alternative/emo parts with clean singing and their style is overall comparable to the second Underoath album. Are you really sure, what you are exactly doing there, Tsstealthp?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNzCyoXb86w

Edit: On the other hand a band like Children Of Gaia is really "core galore" type of band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWTvxuxqxls
Take this as a friendly advice, but maybe you should try to briefly explain in your posts, why do you think the band is not metal, using some style related arguments,. I am sure , it would help the mods andallow you to narrow down your list of bands. The same for your post on the previous page, it is useless to post bands, for which you are convinced, that they have at least one acceptable ep. You can select the two really problematic bands from your list and repost it here.


Hey Witcher, I was going to give details and explanations, but in the end the mods are the ones who take the last word, so in this case I saw it respectfully unnecessary. I think you don't should take it in a radical and extremist way, there is nothing wrong with failing, the human being may not always be right. And with this I mean, asking to delete bands on MA.

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:27 am 
 

ThStealthP wrote:
ThStealthP wrote:

By narrowing down your list I meant this, what I have done above.
Nobody wants you to force the staff your opinion, but generally speaking, if you want someone to ffix a problem, it always helps, if that person knows, what exactly the prolem and its symptoms are.
Full songs of A.Lostfield on Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCto0Ku ... 7pcjOebMtA
Regarding Genius Hired Guns: It may be technically aa side project, but if anything looks out of place here on the site , it is this band. Pure alternative rock, not an ounce of metal in it. Besides that, it was released on a small American indie label, so it was available in EEurope only as a n import and it had zero impact on metal community in general. More songs from the only album:
https://www.youtube.com/user/5stringgod

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~Guest 318854
Rare Earth Metal

Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:16 pm
Posts: 915
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:52 am 
 

Witcher wrote:
ThStealthP wrote:
ThStealthP wrote:

By narrowing down your list I meant this, what I have done above.
Nobody wants you to force the staff your opinion, but generally speaking, if you want someone to ffix a problem, it always helps, if that person knows, what exactly the prolem and its symptoms are.


Thanks Witcher, I take it into account, from now on. What happens I wanted to save space.

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Midnightwards666
Heavy Metal C-3PO

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:05 am
Posts: 975
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:46 am 
 

Witcher, we appreciate that you're trying to help, but please refrain from instructing users on how to bring up bands in this thread. If there is a problem, we will inform the user... and if there isn't, we won't. There are now 7 posts in between this one and ThStealthP's list, and it would be nice to keep things simpler. I'm not sure how the other staff feel, but I didn't find anything wrong with his post. We can easily click the links and listen, I don't think we need an explanation.
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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:09 pm 
 

I have also meant, that thinking about the reasons, why he tthinks a band is not metal, would hhelp him narrow his list a bit, since Azazel is not the only band, which I don't understand the reason, why he has chosen to post them here,but my main concern, which still makes me a bit nervous, is the slow progress of this thread. I know I may be repeting myself, but there are still unprocessed request of mine on the previous page and I have just found out one from two pages back. That's why I wanted to help him with his long, but imo just a bit unrefined list

On a side note, one of the seven posts you have mentioned is my repost of his old , still unprocessed band list, to which I have only added some more samples.
. But, nevermind, you are right, that the long posts are makingthe thread hardr to overlook, so I will stop on the topic of that band list.

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:54 pm 
 

Hunde des Krieges (Germany):
Not thrash metal, but rac, which is similar in style to the personally related band Division Germania or Rebel Hell.
https://aryan-voice.blogspot.com/2015/0 ... -2014.html
http://88nsm.com/8147-hunde-des-krieges ... -2014.html
For comparison:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8hLawNGMLs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwiMEr67hzU

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Krister Jensen
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:48 am
Posts: 376
PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2019 3:15 am 
 

Removed Anaemia (Russia), predominantly rock.

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:37 am 
 

Horss (Russia): Not thrash metal, but hatecore/rac:
https://horss.bandcamp.com/
http://www.rac-forum.org/forum/showthread.php?t=34570
http://88nsm.com/11195-horss-demo-2001-2016.html
http://88nsm.com/229-xorss-soprotivlyajsya2008.html
http://88nsm.com/210-xorss-rossiya-dlya ... x2002.html

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PaganiusI
Zee Bombelecher

Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:49 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:37 am 
 

Please don't bump stuff that's still on page one. That's note useful, thanks.
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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:01 pm 
 

Crosscut (Germany) : A mixture of nu-metal and metalcore:
https://open.spotify.com/album/05kUGUMRBsIRYKGRaI8CuT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aj45omb ... FB6944D650
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fIYL1bSbk4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jciYRFWSgpE
--------------------
Gunjah (Germany): Not thrash/crossover, but rapcore/proto-nu-metal.
TThere is a reason, why their albums were recently posted in a blog dedicated to nu-metal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdKba0F_EBI
https://descargasnumetal4ever.blogspot. ... h?q=gunjah

---------------------

Edit: Morgenröte (Germany): gothic/nu-metal in the style of Evanescence or Exilia with some metalcore influences:
http://88nsm.com/1525-morgenr246te-lich ... -2010.html
http://88nsm.com/8233-morgenrote-moment ... -2014.html

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~Guest 368187
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:16 pm
Posts: 751
PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2019 1:23 pm 
 

Deleted Rigor Morits from Herne, Germany. Same band as the Rigor Morits from Gelsenkirchen, Germany.

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2019 1:46 pm 
 

Symphony Of Sorrow (Sweden): A mixture of gothic rock , alternative rock and nu-metal. There is only one real groove metal song on the first album and the second album is in a similar style:
https://archive.org/details/SymphonyOfS ... seLost1999
https://archive.org/details/SymphonyOfS ... Hatred2005
http://88nsm.com/2311-symphony-of-sorro ... -1999.html
http://88nsm.com/2311-symphony-of-sorro ... -1999.html

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Muhammadabbadabba
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 8:00 pm
Posts: 1306
Location: R'lyeh
PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 3:13 am 
 

Witcher wrote:
Symphony Of Sorrow (Sweden): A mixture of gothic rock , alternative rock and nu-metal. There is only one real groove metal song on the first album and the second album is in a similar style:
https://archive.org/details/SymphonyOfS ... seLost1999
https://archive.org/details/SymphonyOfS ... Hatred2005
http://88nsm.com/2311-symphony-of-sorro ... -1999.html
http://88nsm.com/2311-symphony-of-sorro ... -1999.html

I brought this up three or four years back with Zodijackyl and Azmodes. Symphony of Sorrow was determined to be acceptably Alternative/Groove Metal, although incredibly borderline. I'd argue there's also Post-Grunge in their sound on the first album, but that's another story. Symphony of Hatred makes a marginally better case for their inclusion.
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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2019 9:14 am 
 

Maggie's Madness (Germany):
The band had always played pure hard rock under this name and their only heavy metal release is the album Love Attack" under the name Wildcat. Mmmaggies's Madness releases are in the hard rock style both a¨fter the band's reformation and also during the eighties:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc5tmD1znho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bbz5b5JEnQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23KiX-c ... eKRx_Wkynl
https://open.spotify.com/artist/7b9yvpxapsF1Mywmygcel6

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0th
Suicidal Angel

Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:59 pm
Posts: 261
Location: China
PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2019 8:19 pm 
 

I removed DVP Project since it's the band's mistake. The album should be out in Jan. 2020.

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Midnightwards666
Heavy Metal C-3PO

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:05 am
Posts: 975
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:24 pm 
 

Following a report from RunningWild_AT, Shadow (USA) has been deleted. Not only does it appear that the submitter confused them with another band, but that band (Hyts) wasn't even metal at all. It was hard rock.
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~Guest 368187
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:16 pm
Posts: 751
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 2:04 pm 
 

Removed Årsynål from Vegas, same band as Arsynal from NY (later relocated to Vegas).

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:35 pm 
 

La Brigada (Chile): Hardcore based grindcore, not death/grind.
http://musica-nazionalista.blogspot.com ... -2003.html

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:55 pm 
 

Crack (Russia):
Their split album has only two valid crossover songs (the opener and the closer of their part of the split), the rest is some kind of dirty punk'n'roll, so the album is not predominently. metal. This is the album the band got accepted on, since all their older stuff is apparently pure punk rock:
http://88nsm.com/7294-crack-calvados-sp ... sless.html

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OpsiusCato
Mexican Metal Inquisition

Joined: Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:42 am
Posts: 3006
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:16 am 
 

Deleted Lux ex Tenebris from Peru. Proven to be plagiarists and stealing their entire musical output, plus being a streaming-only band with no valid releases, neither physical nor digital. Their sole release, "Konx om Pax" consists of six tracks stolen from Satanic Warmaster albums.
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I'm going to an illegal AnarchoPunkfest in an abandoned disco near a beach. If I'm not here tomorrow look for me in jail.
PhiloFrog, making accurate statements as usual, wrote:
Opsius is Metal as fuck.

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OpsiusCato
Mexican Metal Inquisition

Joined: Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:42 am
Posts: 3006
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 2:11 am 
 

Deleted Nocturnal Frost from Peru. Proven to be plagiarists and stealing most of their total musical output from the Max Payne soundtrack and Thy Light.
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Uncolored, on being a law-abiding citizen wrote:
I'm going to an illegal AnarchoPunkfest in an abandoned disco near a beach. If I'm not here tomorrow look for me in jail.
PhiloFrog, making accurate statements as usual, wrote:
Opsius is Metal as fuck.

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Krister Jensen
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:48 am
Posts: 376
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:39 am 
 

Removed Ratio Tenebris (Spain), didn't notice the price was €666 =/

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:22 am 
 

Rrancatoco (Bra):
Hardcore based grindcore, full demo:
https://www.youtube.com/user/guinozella

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:26 pm 
 

The Pisces: Starts as groove meta, but quickly turns into nu-metal/industrial:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR5YPyc9LHc

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:33 pm 
 

Eyeblast - not heavy/alternative metal, but pure nu-metal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVY0mA_Exk0
https://www.youtube.com/user/officialEYEBLASTtube

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:01 pm 
 

Global Infected (GEr): They first two albums are purely modern hardcore and their third album is imo hardcore based metalcre, whichis overfilled with jumpy breakdowns.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIvbW3v ... 3xpgmAbevX
http://www.rac-forum.org/forum/showthread.php?p=372716

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Shadechaser
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:06 am
Posts: 211
Location: Russia
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 11:15 pm 
 

sorry for (maybe) wrong thread, just don't want to create a new one...
question: what if some old album been completely re-recorded, mixed and mastered - should I add it as another version or a new album?

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 7145
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:45 am 
 

In regards to the post above, there's a special thread intended forsite-related question here:
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=94071&p=2880216#p2880216

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OpsiusCato
Mexican Metal Inquisition

Joined: Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:42 am
Posts: 3006
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:11 pm 
 

Shadechaser wrote:
sorry for (maybe) wrong thread, just don't want to create a new one...
question: what if some old album been completely re-recorded, mixed and mastered - should I add it as another version or a new album?

The way you describe it, counts as a new album and not just another version.

Next time use the thread Witcher mentioned, please.
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Uncolored, on being a law-abiding citizen wrote:
I'm going to an illegal AnarchoPunkfest in an abandoned disco near a beach. If I'm not here tomorrow look for me in jail.
PhiloFrog, making accurate statements as usual, wrote:
Opsius is Metal as fuck.

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Midnightwards666
Heavy Metal C-3PO

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:05 am
Posts: 975
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:22 pm 
 

Following a report from Antioch, Sulphuric Blood (USA) has been deleted. Same band as Paradoxical Obscurity, released an album under a different title and band name in 2017 but there was no original material.
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Formerly known as HouseSpiders
vacca wrote:
"Pointwhoring is no fun. Pointwhoring endangers the life and happiness of millions. It must stop. We appeal in particular to the youth of today, stop the madness. There are better things in life."

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Mou
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 3:48 pm
Posts: 13
PostPosted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 8:23 am 
 

I got this message when tried to add Apokryphon:

Quote:
Please wait until the album is actually released on February 7th. For a band to qualify, it must have at least one (valid) release already out and available to the public at the time of submission. Pre-orders DO NOT count. If the album is in fact available in some form at the time of your submission, you need to provide hard evidence for this.


I included a YouTube link with the full album available which has been shared by the label in social media. Would'n this count as the album is in fact available in some form at the time of your submission?

Thanks in advance :)

PS: I'm just asking to know for future cases, no complains or blaming nobody, my english is not very good and I don't know if it may sound a little harsh.

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PaganiusI
Zee Bombelecher

Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:49 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 10:58 am 
 

Stream-only releases are not valid releases by our standards, so a youtube stream alone isn't the basis for an inclusion into the database. Which is also stated in our rules ;)
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