Blah, this is probably gonna get shot down or something, but I'd just like to point out that Underoath is nothing near what actual screamo is, like at all.

I guess it's like when black metal kids get pissed off about people calling stuff like Cradle Of Filth black metal, you know? I predominantly listen to screamo and hardcore, and yeah... poppy whiny metalcore is not at all the same. Screamo's more along the lines of stuff like Ampere and Orchid:
http://myspace.com/chaosisorchid
http://myspace.com/amperepunkx

I'm just saying it should help with the integrity of accuracy on M-A which is otherwise very spot on with a lot of metal, but kinda off on this one, which is understandable because it's well outside of what the metal community is into.

First let us get things clear. You are aware, that Underoath are here for their first two albums and not their well known stuff. If they have recorded only the album you seem to hold in high esteem, they would never get listed here.

And what do you propose ?
Alternative rock/metalcore or modern rock/metalcore?

Agreed. This is like going to a hardcore page and having them list Underoath as 'Black/thrash/death metal (early)'...

Are you referring to the OP or to what Witcher said?

The OP. I'm not a fan of Screamo by any means, but Underoath are in no way related to the style. Contray to popular belief, Screamo isn't just emo with screaming. Underoath actually sound nothing like screamo, to a general metal fan who doesn't listen to metalcore maybe, but not universally, just like Underoath isn't thrash/death/black metal but may sound that way to a hardcore-only fan.

I guess I need to fix one of my reviews of Underoath, then, because I called them screamo.

are there ANY bands that changed from metal to screamo?

I think the solution is to delete Underoath.

...from existence.

delete some other gay shit like dethklok and lamb of god

Underoath are fuckin emo screamo pussies

:facepalm:

i love all of their albums except act of depression, i know they arent really metal anymore, im just saying they arent currently hardcore or screamo.



considering the new stuff sounds like botch meets thursday, id say alternative/metalcore is damn accurate

I vote, then, that we change Underoath's Genre tag to read:

"Groove Metal / Deathcore (early), Not Metal So Who The Fuck Cares (later)"

This is the Metal Archives. I'd say the job of the site is to get the Metal part right, not the non-Metal bullshit.

im just saying that a database should be accurate, and protip: hating things for not being metal is retarded.

Who said I hate it? I never implied an opinion. I simply said it's not Metal, so why should we care to keep it updated? It's time wasted on a band that is no longer Metal that could be better spent on other tasks.

because it still gives a sense of misinformation

once more, its like calling cradle of filth black metal, it's a situation that's just like, 'come on guys.'

Then imagine what, Cradle of Filth did play black metal on their first few releases. A symphonic, accessible version of it, but still having all the sound and characteristics of the genre.

Misinformation would be to exclude it to just please some kvlt kiddies and the likes.

So once again, what exactly is your point? The current genre could just be "modern hardcore " to give a general info.

but modern hardcore would imply its something like have heart or guns up!, which it really isnt

modern hardcore is pretty much an umbrella term.
They do not sound like Minor Threat or Agnostic Front, that is for certain...

why not just use a term that's accurate as apposed to an inaccurate umbrella term?

and once more, they dont sound like any modern hardcore bands :/

O.K., either they will be listed as alternative/metalcore or as was already proposed, their new stuff will be listed as "Not Metal So Who The Fuck Cares (later)".

It is quite strange, that you are making such uproar on a metal site for a non-metal genre. Next we will have to solve, which kind of techno music was an ispiration for The Berzerker (there were already some reports), but then without me, since I could not stand a tone from presented genre samples.

because i get irritated when something is incorrectly labeled and i felt the need to point it out? i have no clue, i just thought id point that out.

Exactly, but Underoath are not and were never a screamo band. No one's sticking up for Underoath, but more trying to explain to you that screamo is NOT stuff like Underoath, Bullet for My Valentine, Atreyo, Avenged Sevenfold or whatever. Actual screamo fans would hate such bands, including Underoath, and infact would probably be just as ignorant as their MA page is and refer to them as death metal or something.

it's like a never ending battle in hardcore-land to explain to kids with fringe bangs that they're not part of our scene

Cradle of Filth never played black metal. The "Vempire" EP and the "Dusk & Her Embrace" album had slight traces of it, but that's about it. The debut was a mixture of RiB-era Slayer and symphonic death metal à la "Soulside Journey", Thou Shalt Suffer, etc., and later stuff went in the same direction with more goth influences and only marginal hints of post(!!!)-black metal.

Maybe because this site is metal-archives.com, not witchers-blog.com. Your opinions about former metal bands turning into something else is well known, that doesn't mean you have to insist on not providing accurate information for what ever that "something else" is they have become. It's "Encyclopaedia Metallum", not "Myspaceia Metallum", it's about accurate information, not about being a social platform for mods to prove their "metalness" to their peers.

Yes, I mean stuff like Dusk and Her Embrace plus Vampire and plus The Principle.
It had the guitar tone, speed, vocals, and compositional approach with added keyboards.
The Principle of Evil - Slayer worship??
No really, let us be serious.

The ever returning denial of "underground" fans is extremely tiresome.

You must be either deaf, or you never heard the album. There is not a single BM riff on Principle, but loads of brutal thrash riffs. And for your information, I do enjoy the album occasionally, however, I do not need give it false genre descriptions to feel oh-so-open-minded about myself. It's a good symphonic death/thrash album with hints of goth influence, nothing more, nothing less.

You had no idea yourself, what this something else is. No, you had to show off again. It was me, who reviewed their old albums objectively, remember??

I have changed it to alternative, metalcore, it comes a bit close, but heaven only knows, if it is optimal.

How about finally minding your own issues. I have asked you to do it repeatedly??

Metal IS my issue, and supporting it with every fibre of my body is part of it. Constructive criticism for the world's biggest site on the subject is a natural conclusion. You'll more likely succeed in making Arnold Schwarzenegger to speak English accent-free than you will succeed in getting me off my fanatism about heavy metal.

Symphonic death/thrash, really great.

Care to elaborate?
I have heard the album. Is the guitar tone not muddy enough for you??
They have not more to do with eightiers thrash than Marduk have - certain inspiration, but full on thrash album??
Not everybody can be Alpha Drone or another undeground legend??
A metal fanatic's music would sound different, a metal fanatic would also avoid to make any noise/experimental recordings under his metal band's name.

The hardcore/screamo tag was used, because users have reported it so, not because it would scream utter non-metal shit. Otherwise I do not care. It is only not needed to bring up certain bands to the spotlight again and again, be it by their fans or enemies.

Second time in a row you try to play the, like you people so quaintly call it, "kvlt-kiddie"-card. I guess that I barely even listen to "raw" BM doesn't count for anything, as long as you can cough up random clichés as a cop-out.

Anyway, listen to the first two riffs of the title track and compare them to the slower songs on "Reign in Blood". Listen to the whole beginning of the song after it and compare it to the first Darkthrone, Obituary, Bolt Thrower, any slow early death metal band, and the second half for - once again - Slayer-esque thrash riffing. After the following interlude, it once again begins with thrash-style riffing, then turns into death/doom for the majority of the song, until it turns towards old school death metal riffing again. Still no black metal in sight. Another interlude follows, then we have a simple riff that is somewhat Bathory-influenced, but turns into old school death metal territory again in a matter of seconds. Do I really need to go on? Anyone who knows the album knows that it isn't a black metal album.

Addendum: The next song after the last one I talked about alternates between old school death metal similar to early Hypocrisy and keyboard driven goth, and the song after it could basically pass as a My Dying Bride song with screechy vocals. After that there is only one song left, which is basically just a sped-up version of Amorphis with it's bubblegummy keyboard leads and everything, my least favourite song on the album.

No, you do not have to go on, I do not hear any original, unmodified thrash riffs on it. Entirely your personal opinion. I cannot force you to change it, but I will never respect it.
I do not bring up the kvlt kiddie card, but a pretentious, self-centered bm musician card, who is convinced about his genius and likes the sound of his own voice. Generally, not only in this minor matter .

I personally like to work for this site, but users who constantly show up with their absurdities whereever i go on the forum are not making it easy for me.
So once again, go away please, mind your own stuff, I am not interested to hear anything from you on this or other similar issues. Clear enough.

Remember the mp3.de link I have posted some time ago?? It was not only me, who had similar issues with you.

What link is that?

Besides, intentionally giving dozens of bands false genre tags just to prove a point doesn't make you look any less pretentious.

Now you have done it , you have finally crossed the line. False accusations, huh??
How do you dare to lie so blatanly?
I have told here, why this link was given to Underoath. Devildriver's first album was listed as metalcore, with which it has to common and it was only changed upon massive complaints of their fans, which wanted to have it listed as nu-metal, do not ask me why, I do not know, but you can find some old devildriver threads here on the forum . So the already established term mallcore was used.

http://www.mp3.de/musik/genre/band/060200/283670/1
I'm slightly amused (Basarab) 31.10.2006


Als Kritiker denunziert dieser "Künstler" andere Musiker indem er ihnen "Mangel an künstlerischer Integrität" vorwirft, als Musiker ist er nichtmal in der Lage seine Instrumente richtig zu stimmen (man beachte "Sword & Spirit"), geschweige denn eine schlüssige Songstruktur zu schreiben.

Bei aller offensichtlichen Arroganz des Bandleaders von "Alpha Drone" fällt mir persönlich ein Phänomen auf von dem viele junge Musiker befallen sind - der Irrglaube, dass das Image einer Band wichtiger sei als das musikalische Können.

"Alpha Drone" bekommt 2 Punkte für Atmosphäre und Authentizität, und damit mehr Respekt als er selbst anderen Künstlern entgegenbringt. Eine höhere Wertung wäre wegen des qualitativen Mangels des Materials unangemessen.

Again, what link is that?

EDIT: I see. The guy who got banned of this forum for posting several threads complaining about my review, then harassing me on ICQ, then trolling the Alpha Drone page on Metal Archives with fake releases and links. Yes, that's certainly a good reference.

Trogbog? He does not speak German, at least certainly not so well. He was random British pseudo -nazi kiddie, who has noticed you only quite recently.
His mockery was always English only.

Whoever wrote the comment, he is spot on.
Anyway, there was a false accusation from your side and i will act accordingly in the future.

Nah, not the one that screwed with the entire site a few months ago. Someone trolled the Alpha Drone site a while ago with some random nonsense. I removed the fake link and failsafeman removed the fake album, and it was a German, and I'm quite certain it was the Basarab guy, because it matched his previous antics. I don't think I'll ever understand people's issues with me. Loads of other people write excessively negative reviews of popular bands or outspokenly voice very unpopular opinions, yet everyone seems to focus on me for retaliation. I'm flattered, I guess. Still, it seems a bit pointless. If people want to whine like little babies about someone, how about starting with the management of central banks, important political leads, or heads of big corporations? Just a thought.

You already do whatever you want, so what difference will it make in the future?